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Posted Jan 10, 2011
6:53:13 AM
Refurb Roulette

Hi Everyone,

 

Like others in this thread, I've now obtained multiple refurbished Samsumg Captivates, all which randomly shut down.  I'm now stuck in an endless cycle where I return my Captivate only to receive another refurbished Captivate which also randomly shuts down.  When I explain to customer service the issue, they have no clue, and they cannot guarantee to me that my new IMEI will be in the functional range

 

Surely AT&T is aware of the issue as it has been discussed ad-nausem on the Internet, noted in this very forum, and Samsung has made them aware of which phones contain the hardware defect. 

 

Why would AT&T knowingly send defective phones to customers whey they claim that all refurbished phones are vigorously tested?  They also claim the refurbished devices are 'Like New', but the Captivate obviously doesn't fit under this umbrella because defective phones are knowningly being send to customers.  Is it possible that by some freak incident I've only received Captivates that have slipped through the testing process?  Maybe, but why am I still receiving devices which are obviously in the defective IMEI range?

 

How exactly am I supposed to break out of this cycle?  I really like the Captivate and want to keep the same model as my wife.  I'm also scared to buy a new one because I could still get one in the invalid range since Samsung has instructed AT&T to deplete the current inventory.

 

Really frustrated and would love to hear some feedback,

 

Thanks

Hi Everyone,

 

Like others in this thread, I've now obtained multiple refurbished Samsumg Captivates, all which randomly shut down.  I'm now stuck in an endless cycle where I return my Captivate only to receive another refurbished Captivate which also randomly shuts down.  When I explain to customer service the issue, they have no clue, and they cannot guarantee to me that my new IMEI will be in the functional range

 

Surely AT&T is aware of the issue as it has been discussed ad-nausem on the Internet, noted in this very forum, and Samsung has made them aware of which phones contain the hardware defect. 

 

Why would AT&T knowingly send defective phones to customers whey they claim that all refurbished phones are vigorously tested?  They also claim the refurbished devices are 'Like New', but the Captivate obviously doesn't fit under this umbrella because defective phones are knowningly being send to customers.  Is it possible that by some freak incident I've only received Captivates that have slipped through the testing process?  Maybe, but why am I still receiving devices which are obviously in the defective IMEI range?

 

How exactly am I supposed to break out of this cycle?  I really like the Captivate and want to keep the same model as my wife.  I'm also scared to buy a new one because I could still get one in the invalid range since Samsung has instructed AT&T to deplete the current inventory.

 

Really frustrated and would love to hear some feedback,

 

Thanks

Refurb Roulette

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Jan 10, 2011 8:16:52 AM
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AT&T doesn't repair and test the refurbished phones, Samsung does. The warranty exchange program is a courtesy done by AT&T that allows you to have a phone so you won't be without one while the manufacturer looks at and repairs your phone. If there are phones that need to be depleted out it is up to Samsung to replace the phones that AT&T bought from them as they are sent back.

AT&T doesn't repair and test the refurbished phones, Samsung does. The warranty exchange program is a courtesy done by AT&T that allows you to have a phone so you won't be without one while the manufacturer looks at and repairs your phone. If there are phones that need to be depleted out it is up to Samsung to replace the phones that AT&T bought from them as they are sent back.

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Jan 10, 2011 9:08:15 AM
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Edited by BPerniciaro on Jan 10, 2011 at 9:16:21 AM

Thanks for the reply sitnsidewayz,

 

I think I now see why I'm stuck in an endless, mindless loop:

 

1.  AT&T claims all of its refurbished phones are 'Like New' and fully tested.

2.  I order a refurbished phone from AT&T (assuming it is 'Like New' and fully tested)

3.  The phone doesn't work because it has a known defect

4.  I inform AT&T of the issue, but it isn't their problem, it's Samsung's

5.  Samsung instructs AT&T to replace my phone with one in the working IAEA range because there is a known defect (see earlier linked document).

6.  AT&T sends me another defective phone in the known defect range

7.  Repeat steps 4-6 indefinitely.

 

Now I may be a bit paranoid, but this sure smells like the run-around.  The one entity who can solve the problem, Samsung, doesn't provide the Phone, AT&T does.  And of course, the company I'm interfacing with, AT&T can't help me because it's not their problem, they're just doing me a courtesy.

 

It seems to me that this is a problem between AT&T & Samsung, but here I am in the middle with a defective phone and no mechanism to have it resolved as both parties point at each other.  This stinks to high heaven.

 

I re-upped with AT&T in-part because they offered an Android device with a large screen, but I'm now left with a new contract, a phone that is defective, and no other options from AT&T's product line. Nice.

Thanks for the reply sitnsidewayz,

 

I think I now see why I'm stuck in an endless, mindless loop:

 

1.  AT&T claims all of its refurbished phones are 'Like New' and fully tested.

2.  I order a refurbished phone from AT&T (assuming it is 'Like New' and fully tested)

3.  The phone doesn't work because it has a known defect

4.  I inform AT&T of the issue, but it isn't their problem, it's Samsung's

5.  Samsung instructs AT&T to replace my phone with one in the working IAEA range because there is a known defect (see earlier linked document).

6.  AT&T sends me another defective phone in the known defect range

7.  Repeat steps 4-6 indefinitely.

 

Now I may be a bit paranoid, but this sure smells like the run-around.  The one entity who can solve the problem, Samsung, doesn't provide the Phone, AT&T does.  And of course, the company I'm interfacing with, AT&T can't help me because it's not their problem, they're just doing me a courtesy.

 

It seems to me that this is a problem between AT&T & Samsung, but here I am in the middle with a defective phone and no mechanism to have it resolved as both parties point at each other.  This stinks to high heaven.

 

I re-upped with AT&T in-part because they offered an Android device with a large screen, but I'm now left with a new contract, a phone that is defective, and no other options from AT&T's product line. Nice.

Re: Refurb Roulette

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Jan 10, 2011 1:14:03 PM
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BPerniciaro wrote:

Thanks for the reply sitnsidewayz,

 

I think I now see why I'm stuck in an endless, mindless loop:

 

1.  AT&T claims all of its refurbished phones are 'Like New' and fully tested.

2.  I order a refurbished phone from AT&T (assuming it is 'Like New' and fully tested)

3.  The phone doesn't work because it has a known defect

4.  I inform AT&T of the issue, but it isn't their problem, it's Samsung's

5.  Samsung instructs AT&T to replace my phone with one in the working IAEA range because there is a known defect (see earlier linked document).

6.  AT&T sends me another defective phone in the known defect range

7.  Repeat steps 4-6 indefinitely.

 

Now I may be a bit paranoid, but this sure smells like the run-around.  The one entity who can solve the problem, Samsung, doesn't provide the Phone, AT&T does.  And of course, the company I'm interfacing with, AT&T can't help me because it's not their problem, they're just doing me a courtesy.

 

It seems to me that this is a problem between AT&T & Samsung, but here I am in the middle with a defective phone and no mechanism to have it resolved as both parties point at each other.  This stinks to high heaven.

 

I re-upped with AT&T in-part because they offered an Android device with a large screen, but I'm now left with a new contract, a phone that is defective, and no other options from AT&T's product line. Nice.


Exactly. Samsung needs to pony up and come out with a fix. I've always had horrible luck with Samsung devices and vowed never to get a Samsung device ever again and I have kept up with that vow. Typically, if you have to send the same model device back more than twice, AT&T will let you switch to a different refurbished model that is comparable, although I'm not sure what would be comparable with your device. You might want to query AT&T about this, as I'm not sure if they still do this. You could also try dealing with Samsung directly.


BPerniciaro wrote:

Thanks for the reply sitnsidewayz,

 

I think I now see why I'm stuck in an endless, mindless loop:

 

1.  AT&T claims all of its refurbished phones are 'Like New' and fully tested.

2.  I order a refurbished phone from AT&T (assuming it is 'Like New' and fully tested)

3.  The phone doesn't work because it has a known defect

4.  I inform AT&T of the issue, but it isn't their problem, it's Samsung's

5.  Samsung instructs AT&T to replace my phone with one in the working IAEA range because there is a known defect (see earlier linked document).

6.  AT&T sends me another defective phone in the known defect range

7.  Repeat steps 4-6 indefinitely.

 

Now I may be a bit paranoid, but this sure smells like the run-around.  The one entity who can solve the problem, Samsung, doesn't provide the Phone, AT&T does.  And of course, the company I'm interfacing with, AT&T can't help me because it's not their problem, they're just doing me a courtesy.

 

It seems to me that this is a problem between AT&T & Samsung, but here I am in the middle with a defective phone and no mechanism to have it resolved as both parties point at each other.  This stinks to high heaven.

 

I re-upped with AT&T in-part because they offered an Android device with a large screen, but I'm now left with a new contract, a phone that is defective, and no other options from AT&T's product line. Nice.


Exactly. Samsung needs to pony up and come out with a fix. I've always had horrible luck with Samsung devices and vowed never to get a Samsung device ever again and I have kept up with that vow. Typically, if you have to send the same model device back more than twice, AT&T will let you switch to a different refurbished model that is comparable, although I'm not sure what would be comparable with your device. You might want to query AT&T about this, as I'm not sure if they still do this. You could also try dealing with Samsung directly.

Re: Refurb Roulette

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Jan 11, 2011 12:58:22 AM
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BPerniciaro wrote:

5.  Samsung instructs AT&T to replace my phone with one in the working IAEA range because there is a known defect (see earlier linked document).


 

I looked at the document you linked to and I do not see that anywhere in the document stating they are to find you one in the working range.

 

Per the document that someone posted(it would have been better to link to the official release on their site, rather than someone re-posting of what may or may not have been posted correctly).

 


Most customers are not expected to see an issue, however the following IMEI range could potentially have the issue

 

This says they may or may not fail.  It doesn't say all within a range are definitely bad.

 


Continue to sell through existing inventory. If a customer has the power off issue when in standby mode please exchange their device. 

 

Here it even says just replace it with one from the current inventory.  Nothing about voiding out certain batches.  Samsung wants AT&T to go thru the entire inventory as they feel not all devices are effected.  Samsung would rather just keep swapping devices that have an entire batch pulled.

 

Yes I agree it's a crappy cycle but Samsung really needs to step up to the plate here and make it right.  It's their policy to use the existing inventory (at least per that posting).

 


BPerniciaro wrote:

5.  Samsung instructs AT&T to replace my phone with one in the working IAEA range because there is a known defect (see earlier linked document).


 

I looked at the document you linked to and I do not see that anywhere in the document stating they are to find you one in the working range.

 

Per the document that someone posted(it would have been better to link to the official release on their site, rather than someone re-posting of what may or may not have been posted correctly).

 


Most customers are not expected to see an issue, however the following IMEI range could potentially have the issue

 

This says they may or may not fail.  It doesn't say all within a range are definitely bad.

 


Continue to sell through existing inventory. If a customer has the power off issue when in standby mode please exchange their device. 

 

Here it even says just replace it with one from the current inventory.  Nothing about voiding out certain batches.  Samsung wants AT&T to go thru the entire inventory as they feel not all devices are effected.  Samsung would rather just keep swapping devices that have an entire batch pulled.

 

Yes I agree it's a crappy cycle but Samsung really needs to step up to the plate here and make it right.  It's their policy to use the existing inventory (at least per that posting).

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Jan 11, 2011 10:30:58 AM
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I can't disagree that it may ultimately be Samsung's fault, but the resolution should be made between AT&T and Samsung in such a way that it doesn't leave the customer hanging out to dry.  If what I read is correct, AT&T as my provider should demand that Samsung provide devices that are proven to be functional.  If Sumsung can't guarantee the it's refurbished models are functional, then AT&T should stop offering refurbished Captivates that they know are in the defective range.  But of course, it's much easier to lure people in with a great phone deal and just point the finger at someone else when a problem arises.

 

In the end, I got out of the refurbished market and just bought a new phone of a different model (definitely not and never again Samsung).  I also made a mental note of the situation and won't forget it the next time my contract comes up for renewal.

I can't disagree that it may ultimately be Samsung's fault, but the resolution should be made between AT&T and Samsung in such a way that it doesn't leave the customer hanging out to dry.  If what I read is correct, AT&T as my provider should demand that Samsung provide devices that are proven to be functional.  If Sumsung can't guarantee the it's refurbished models are functional, then AT&T should stop offering refurbished Captivates that they know are in the defective range.  But of course, it's much easier to lure people in with a great phone deal and just point the finger at someone else when a problem arises.

 

In the end, I got out of the refurbished market and just bought a new phone of a different model (definitely not and never again Samsung).  I also made a mental note of the situation and won't forget it the next time my contract comes up for renewal.

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Jan 11, 2011 9:30:31 PM
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BPerniciaro wrote:

I can't disagree that it may ultimately be Samsung's fault, but the resolution should be made between AT&T and Samsung in such a way that it doesn't leave the customer hanging out to dry.  If what I read is correct, AT&T as my provider should demand that Samsung provide devices that are proven to be functional.  If Sumsung can't guarantee the it's refurbished models are functional, then AT&T should stop offering refurbished Captivates that they know are in the defective range.  But of course, it's much easier to lure people in with a great phone deal and just point the finger at someone else when a problem arises.

 

In the end, I got out of the refurbished market and just bought a new phone of a different model (definitely not and never again Samsung).  I also made a mental note of the situation and won't forget it the next time my contract comes up for renewal.


If that were the case, and if you don't consider the warranty itself a guarantee, then AT&T should stop offering any phone of any model, new or refurbished.  It would be impossible to guarantee upfront that any given unit will not be defective - regardless of the IMEI range, regardless of the model, and regardless of whether it's refurbished or new.  Instead, the warranty is the all-important "or else" part of the only guarantee that can ever be made: It will work, or else this is what we will do.

 

 


I am an AT&T employee and the postings on this site are my own and don’t necessarily represent AT&T’s positions, strategies or opinions.

 


BPerniciaro wrote:

I can't disagree that it may ultimately be Samsung's fault, but the resolution should be made between AT&T and Samsung in such a way that it doesn't leave the customer hanging out to dry.  If what I read is correct, AT&T as my provider should demand that Samsung provide devices that are proven to be functional.  If Sumsung can't guarantee the it's refurbished models are functional, then AT&T should stop offering refurbished Captivates that they know are in the defective range.  But of course, it's much easier to lure people in with a great phone deal and just point the finger at someone else when a problem arises.

 

In the end, I got out of the refurbished market and just bought a new phone of a different model (definitely not and never again Samsung).  I also made a mental note of the situation and won't forget it the next time my contract comes up for renewal.


If that were the case, and if you don't consider the warranty itself a guarantee, then AT&T should stop offering any phone of any model, new or refurbished.  It would be impossible to guarantee upfront that any given unit will not be defective - regardless of the IMEI range, regardless of the model, and regardless of whether it's refurbished or new.  Instead, the warranty is the all-important "or else" part of the only guarantee that can ever be made: It will work, or else this is what we will do.

 

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Edited by BPerniciaro on Jan 12, 2011 at 7:09:24 AM

I would agree in most cases, except in those where there is a KNOWN defect.  This particular model is known to have this problem, and people have even created custom applications like 'Samsung Keepalive' to keep this model of phone from shutting down on itself (although it drains your battery faster).  Sure it's great that there is a warranty, but when that warrenty essentially guarantees that the customer can trade out one defective phone for another, it isn't of much value to the customer is it?

 

Also, Samsung obviously isn't testing Captivates that are refurbished, because reproducing the KNOWN problem is very simple (just fully charge the phone and wait for it to shut down by itself).  If they WERE properly testing these devices, the phones in the invalid IMEIs which exhibit this behavior would be removed from the refurb pool, but obviously they aren't.  At the very least, Samsung should correct the hardware defect before introducing it back into the refurb pool.  Also, AT&T shouldn't claim on their website that all refurbished models are fully tested and 'like new' if they are not. 

I would agree in most cases, except in those where there is a KNOWN defect.  This particular model is known to have this problem, and people have even created custom applications like 'Samsung Keepalive' to keep this model of phone from shutting down on itself (although it drains your battery faster).  Sure it's great that there is a warranty, but when that warrenty essentially guarantees that the customer can trade out one defective phone for another, it isn't of much value to the customer is it?

 

Also, Samsung obviously isn't testing Captivates that are refurbished, because reproducing the KNOWN problem is very simple (just fully charge the phone and wait for it to shut down by itself).  If they WERE properly testing these devices, the phones in the invalid IMEIs which exhibit this behavior would be removed from the refurb pool, but obviously they aren't.  At the very least, Samsung should correct the hardware defect before introducing it back into the refurb pool.  Also, AT&T shouldn't claim on their website that all refurbished models are fully tested and 'like new' if they are not. 

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