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Posted Mar 9, 2008
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GPS on an 881U ?
I just got the AT&T data service, along with a Sierra Wireless 881U.  The specs from SW claim that the 881U has GPS capabilities.  How does one access them?
 
Thanks
I just got the AT&T data service, along with a Sierra Wireless 881U.  The specs from SW claim that the 881U has GPS capabilities.  How does one access them?
 
Thanks

GPS on an 881U ?

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Mar 10, 2008 2:03:11 AM
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Are you sure that it is not GPRS (General Packet Radio Service) capable versus GPS?
Are you sure that it is not GPRS (General Packet Radio Service) capable versus GPS?

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Mar 10, 2008 4:07:23 PM
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Yes, I am sure.  Look at the specs if you don't believe me:
 
http://www.sierrawireless.com/resources/product/AirCard_880U_881U%20Datasheet%20v10.pdf

 

Built-in GPS Antenna:

The AirCard 880U and AirCard 881U

include built-in GPS capability and support

for LBS

Yes, I am sure.  Look at the specs if you don't believe me:
 
http://www.sierrawireless.com/resources/product/AirCard_880U_881U%20Datasheet%20v10.pdf

 

Built-in GPS Antenna:

The AirCard 880U and AirCard 881U

include built-in GPS capability and support

for LBS

Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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Mar 11, 2008 8:57:41 AM
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jayeye wrote:
I just got the AT&T data service, along with a Sierra Wireless 881U.  The specs from SW claim that the 881U has GPS capabilities.  How does one access them?
 
Thanks


GPS is not active on the device.


jayeye wrote:
I just got the AT&T data service, along with a Sierra Wireless 881U.  The specs from SW claim that the 881U has GPS capabilities.  How does one access them?
 
Thanks


GPS is not active on the device.

Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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Mar 18, 2008 3:44:15 PM
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Do you mean that AT&T explicitly removes the GPS capability from the firmware? Shouldn't they say so on the product information?
Do you mean that AT&T explicitly removes the GPS capability from the firmware? Shouldn't they say so on the product information?

Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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Mar 18, 2008 9:05:02 PM
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GPS used in phones are used by CDMA, Verizon and Sprint, not AT&T .. So the GPS is not active for this service.. This is NOT the same as a GPS that uses satellite to triangulate the location.

BAT



http://www.portabledesign.com/article?article_id=112

Location fix is typically accomplished either by radio triangulation between radio base station towers, or by using a GPS (at 1575.42 MHz) device built into the phone itself. GSM/TDMA network operators, such as AT&T and T-Mobile, tend to use the triangulation method while CDMA network operators, such as Verizon and Sprint, tend to use the handset-based GPS method.
GPS used in phones are used by CDMA, Verizon and Sprint, not AT&T .. So the GPS is not active for this service.. This is NOT the same as a GPS that uses satellite to triangulate the location.

BAT



http://www.portabledesign.com/article?article_id=112

Location fix is typically accomplished either by radio triangulation between radio base station towers, or by using a GPS (at 1575.42 MHz) device built into the phone itself. GSM/TDMA network operators, such as AT&T and T-Mobile, tend to use the triangulation method while CDMA network operators, such as Verizon and Sprint, tend to use the handset-based GPS method.

Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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Mar 19, 2008 8:45:20 AM
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Edited by rsnadel on Mar 19, 2008 at 8:47:06 AM
The information by the previous poster is incorrect. AT&T sells the Blackberry Curve 8310, which does include GPS capabiliies. In fact, GPS is the only difference between the 8300 and the 8310:
 
 
Not only that, Google Maps now has the ability to locate a AT&T cell phone that does NOT have GPS capability, simply by using triangulated information gleaned from the phone's signal bouncing off AT&T cell sites.


Message Edited by rsnadel on 03-19-2008 08:47:06 AM
The information by the previous poster is incorrect. AT&T sells the Blackberry Curve 8310, which does include GPS capabiliies. In fact, GPS is the only difference between the 8300 and the 8310:
 
 
Not only that, Google Maps now has the ability to locate a AT&T cell phone that does NOT have GPS capability, simply by using triangulated information gleaned from the phone's signal bouncing off AT&T cell sites.


Message Edited by rsnadel on 03-19-2008 08:47:06 AM

Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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Mar 19, 2008 6:05:47 PM
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jayeye wrote:
Do you mean that AT&T explicitly removes the GPS capability from the firmware? Shouldn't they say so on the product information?


I wouldn't say they remove it, they just don't enable it.  When a telecom like AT&T buy a card from a company like Sierra they choose which options they will provide to their customers.  Another example of this would be voice service.  Sierra cards are capable of making voice calls but AT&T chose not to add that feature, while other companies may like Vodafone in Australia (I think, but don't quote me on that).  As for saying so in product documentation I doubt you'll find an AT&T document that says the 881 includes GPS.

 


I am an AT&T employee and the postings on this site are my own and don’t necessarily represent AT&T’s positions, strategies or opinions.


jayeye wrote:
Do you mean that AT&T explicitly removes the GPS capability from the firmware? Shouldn't they say so on the product information?


I wouldn't say they remove it, they just don't enable it.  When a telecom like AT&T buy a card from a company like Sierra they choose which options they will provide to their customers.  Another example of this would be voice service.  Sierra cards are capable of making voice calls but AT&T chose not to add that feature, while other companies may like Vodafone in Australia (I think, but don't quote me on that).  As for saying so in product documentation I doubt you'll find an AT&T document that says the 881 includes GPS.

Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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Mar 19, 2008 8:32:14 PM
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BlackBerry device user must move to an area where the BlackBerry device is exposed to open sky

The BlackBerry Curve 8310 uses  built in GPS satellite navigation, NOT GPS Tower (at 1575.42 MHz) device built into the phone itself. that use the triangulation from the towers..

This is Just like the TomTom it uses the satellite to received NOT the TOWER, and the 881U GPS is based on TOWER that Verizon uses.

A Link from BlackBerry

http://www.blackberry.com/GPS

  • GPS signal. In order for built-in GPS to work the BlackBerry device is required to be in an area of good coverage so that there is a strong enough signal. If the BlackBerry device is in a building or another area that is covered and is unable to get a signal, the BlackBerry device user must move to an area where the BlackBerry device is exposed to open sky. Some modern cars are now fitted with Athermic windshields which can affect the strength of the GPS signal in the car.
BAT

BlackBerry device user must move to an area where the BlackBerry device is exposed to open sky

The BlackBerry Curve 8310 uses  built in GPS satellite navigation, NOT GPS Tower (at 1575.42 MHz) device built into the phone itself. that use the triangulation from the towers..

This is Just like the TomTom it uses the satellite to received NOT the TOWER, and the 881U GPS is based on TOWER that Verizon uses.

A Link from BlackBerry

http://www.blackberry.com/GPS

  • GPS signal. In order for built-in GPS to work the BlackBerry device is required to be in an area of good coverage so that there is a strong enough signal. If the BlackBerry device is in a building or another area that is covered and is unable to get a signal, the BlackBerry device user must move to an area where the BlackBerry device is exposed to open sky. Some modern cars are now fitted with Athermic windshields which can affect the strength of the GPS signal in the car.
BAT

Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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Mar 20, 2008 9:40:30 AM
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Please remember to stay on topic. Thank you.
Please remember to stay on topic. Thank you.

Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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Mar 23, 2008 2:41:48 AM
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BAT wrote:
GPS used in phones are used by CDMA, Verizon and Sprint, not AT&T .. So the GPS is not active for this service.. This is NOT the same as a GPS that uses satellite to triangulate the location.

BAT



http://www.portabledesign.com/article?article_id=112

Location fix is typically accomplished either by radio triangulation between radio base station towers, or by using a GPS (at 1575.42 MHz) device built into the phone itself. GSM/TDMA network operators, such as AT&T and T-Mobile, tend to use the triangulation method while CDMA network operators, such as Verizon and Sprint, tend to use the handset-based GPS method.





True GPS via satellite has absolutely nothing to do with the operators or what type of network they use or which handsets have what. The 881 devices have true gps with a gps antenna also built in and this thread is about that, not speculation on which carrier's subsidized devices tend to favor fake gps by cellular triangulation, or true GPS that uses satellite triangulation. There is no question that the 881 devices have true gps built in, the question is whether he can access it through software and whether AT&T's firmware has it disabled. It would be silly if they did cripple it since GPS via satellite costs no bandwidth to AT&T as they do not maintain nor operate the satellites.


BAT wrote:
GPS used in phones are used by CDMA, Verizon and Sprint, not AT&T .. So the GPS is not active for this service.. This is NOT the same as a GPS that uses satellite to triangulate the location.

BAT



http://www.portabledesign.com/article?article_id=112

Location fix is typically accomplished either by radio triangulation between radio base station towers, or by using a GPS (at 1575.42 MHz) device built into the phone itself. GSM/TDMA network operators, such as AT&T and T-Mobile, tend to use the triangulation method while CDMA network operators, such as Verizon and Sprint, tend to use the handset-based GPS method.





True GPS via satellite has absolutely nothing to do with the operators or what type of network they use or which handsets have what. The 881 devices have true gps with a gps antenna also built in and this thread is about that, not speculation on which carrier's subsidized devices tend to favor fake gps by cellular triangulation, or true GPS that uses satellite triangulation. There is no question that the 881 devices have true gps built in, the question is whether he can access it through software and whether AT&T's firmware has it disabled. It would be silly if they did cripple it since GPS via satellite costs no bandwidth to AT&T as they do not maintain nor operate the satellites.

Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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Mar 23, 2008 7:07:22 AM
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Davesworld wrote:



True GPS via satellite has absolutely nothing to do with the operators or what type of network they use or which handsets have what. The 881 devices have true gps with a gps antenna also built in and this thread is about that, not speculation on which carrier's subsidized devices tend to favor fake gps by cellular triangulation, or true GPS that uses satellite triangulation. There is no question that the 881 devices have true gps built in, the question is whether he can access it through software and whether AT&T's firmware has it disabled. It would be silly if they did cripple it since GPS via satellite costs no bandwidth to AT&T as they do not maintain nor operate the satellites.

OK, let me correct what I had said, looking at the exact frequency, 1575.42 MHz in which the 881U uses, this is a GPS satellite frequency L1, BUT it transmits it using the CDMA decoding in which verizon uses. I guess for the 881U to work, the gut's of the unit must be set to decode CDMA and not AT&T GSM.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GPS_signals


Davesworld wrote:



True GPS via satellite has absolutely nothing to do with the operators or what type of network they use or which handsets have what. The 881 devices have true gps with a gps antenna also built in and this thread is about that, not speculation on which carrier's subsidized devices tend to favor fake gps by cellular triangulation, or true GPS that uses satellite triangulation. There is no question that the 881 devices have true gps built in, the question is whether he can access it through software and whether AT&T's firmware has it disabled. It would be silly if they did cripple it since GPS via satellite costs no bandwidth to AT&T as they do not maintain nor operate the satellites.

OK, let me correct what I had said, looking at the exact frequency, 1575.42 MHz in which the 881U uses, this is a GPS satellite frequency L1, BUT it transmits it using the CDMA decoding in which verizon uses. I guess for the 881U to work, the gut's of the unit must be set to decode CDMA and not AT&T GSM.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GPS_signals

Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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Mar 23, 2008 2:06:17 PM
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BAT wrote:


Davesworld wrote:



True GPS via satellite has absolutely nothing to do with the operators or what type of network they use or which handsets have what. The 881 devices have true gps with a gps antenna also built in and this thread is about that, not speculation on which carrier's subsidized devices tend to favor fake gps by cellular triangulation, or true GPS that uses satellite triangulation. There is no question that the 881 devices have true gps built in, the question is whether he can access it through software and whether AT&T's firmware has it disabled. It would be silly if they did cripple it since GPS via satellite costs no bandwidth to AT&T as they do not maintain nor operate the satellites.

OK, let me correct what I had said, looking at the exact frequency, 1575.42 MHz in which the 881U uses, this is a GPS satellite frequency L1, BUT it transmits it using the CDMA decoding in which verizon uses. I guess for the 881U to work, the gut's of the unit must be set to decode CDMA and not AT&T GSM.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GPS_signals





No, the GPS is built into the MSM7200 chip itself which has no Cellular CDMA capability, note the distinction of CELLULAR. The GPS function is totally separate from the cellular radio function and has been built into these chipsets for some time even though it resides on the same die, there is no way to set the guts of the unit to decode cellular CDMA and it has nothing to do with the GPS function. CDMA has been used in so many different applications over decades and only in the last decade has it been used in Cellular networks. Actress Hedy Lamarr co-invented the basic principle of CDMA back in the early 40's and it has been used in so many applications since then. Basically, it's spread spectrum technology. Why you assume Verizon and maybe Sprint when you see any technology that makes use of CDMA escapes me. BTW, my Nokia N95-3 has satellite gps built in but is a GSM phone with GPRS/EDGE UMTS/HSDPA data capability and of course wifi. Even though the GPS portion may use CDMA technology to and from the satellites, this has nothing to do with the cellular radio itself, doesn't even use the same antenna.


BAT wrote:


Davesworld wrote:



True GPS via satellite has absolutely nothing to do with the operators or what type of network they use or which handsets have what. The 881 devices have true gps with a gps antenna also built in and this thread is about that, not speculation on which carrier's subsidized devices tend to favor fake gps by cellular triangulation, or true GPS that uses satellite triangulation. There is no question that the 881 devices have true gps built in, the question is whether he can access it through software and whether AT&T's firmware has it disabled. It would be silly if they did cripple it since GPS via satellite costs no bandwidth to AT&T as they do not maintain nor operate the satellites.

OK, let me correct what I had said, looking at the exact frequency, 1575.42 MHz in which the 881U uses, this is a GPS satellite frequency L1, BUT it transmits it using the CDMA decoding in which verizon uses. I guess for the 881U to work, the gut's of the unit must be set to decode CDMA and not AT&T GSM.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GPS_signals





No, the GPS is built into the MSM7200 chip itself which has no Cellular CDMA capability, note the distinction of CELLULAR. The GPS function is totally separate from the cellular radio function and has been built into these chipsets for some time even though it resides on the same die, there is no way to set the guts of the unit to decode cellular CDMA and it has nothing to do with the GPS function. CDMA has been used in so many different applications over decades and only in the last decade has it been used in Cellular networks. Actress Hedy Lamarr co-invented the basic principle of CDMA back in the early 40's and it has been used in so many applications since then. Basically, it's spread spectrum technology. Why you assume Verizon and maybe Sprint when you see any technology that makes use of CDMA escapes me. BTW, my Nokia N95-3 has satellite gps built in but is a GSM phone with GPRS/EDGE UMTS/HSDPA data capability and of course wifi. Even though the GPS portion may use CDMA technology to and from the satellites, this has nothing to do with the cellular radio itself, doesn't even use the same antenna.

Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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Mar 23, 2008 2:18:02 PM
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Edited by Davesworld on Mar 23, 2008 at 2:21:12 PM

jayeye wrote:
Yes, I am sure. Look at the specs if you don't believe me:
http://www.sierrawireless.com/resources/product/AirCard_880U_881U%20Datasheet%20v10.pdf

Built-in GPS Antenna:

The AirCard 880U and AirCard 881U

include built-in GPS capability and support

for LBS






You need to install one of the map programs to use it. Here is some pasted text from Sierra:

TRU-Locate™ Solution
Determine where you are, and how to get where you need to be.
Easily integrate with Google Maps, Microsoft Live, Mapquest etc…
Supports 3rd party applications for Route Optimization, Dispatch and Resource Monitoring
Standalone, Static-GPS Assisted, A-GPS capabilities supported
Customers will experience enhanced location services with Sierra Wireless products.

Message Edited by Davesworld on 03-23-2008 02:21:12 PM

jayeye wrote:
Yes, I am sure. Look at the specs if you don't believe me:
http://www.sierrawireless.com/resources/product/AirCard_880U_881U%20Datasheet%20v10.pdf

Built-in GPS Antenna:

The AirCard 880U and AirCard 881U

include built-in GPS capability and support

for LBS






You need to install one of the map programs to use it. Here is some pasted text from Sierra:

TRU-Locate™ Solution
Determine where you are, and how to get where you need to be.
Easily integrate with Google Maps, Microsoft Live, Mapquest etc…
Supports 3rd party applications for Route Optimization, Dispatch and Resource Monitoring
Standalone, Static-GPS Assisted, A-GPS capabilities supported
Customers will experience enhanced location services with Sierra Wireless products.

Message Edited by Davesworld on 03-23-2008 02:21:12 PM

Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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After more research, I have found that you have Location Based Services (LBS), service. For the GPS to work..

Now for the TRU-Locate™ Solution, the 881U I have does not have this software, and I cannot find any downloads for this..

IF someone has any insight, on the LBS, now the time to speak up...


BAT



After more research, I have found that you have Location Based Services (LBS), service. For the GPS to work..

Now for the TRU-Locate™ Solution, the 881U I have does not have this software, and I cannot find any downloads for this..

IF someone has any insight, on the LBS, now the time to speak up...


BAT



Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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BAT wrote:
After more research, I have found that you have Location Based Services (LBS), service. For the GPS to work..

Now for the TRU-Locate™ Solution, the 881U I have does not have this software, and I cannot find any downloads for this..

IF someone has any insight, on the LBS, now the time to speak up...


BAT








So now you have an 881?


BAT wrote:
After more research, I have found that you have Location Based Services (LBS), service. For the GPS to work..

Now for the TRU-Locate™ Solution, the 881U I have does not have this software, and I cannot find any downloads for this..

IF someone has any insight, on the LBS, now the time to speak up...


BAT








So now you have an 881?

Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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Mar 23, 2008 8:08:28 PM
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Download and install Google maps and see what happens.
Download and install Google maps and see what happens.

Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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Davesworld wrote:



So now you have an 881?

Yep !! 881U   - With the USB, I can place an extended usb cable to move it around to get a better signal, I have a weak service where I use my laptop..

BAT


Davesworld wrote:



So now you have an 881?

Yep !! 881U   - With the USB, I can place an extended usb cable to move it around to get a better signal, I have a weak service where I use my laptop..

BAT

Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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Davesworld wrote:
Download and install Google maps and see what happens.


Davesworld, And this worked for you ?  


BAT


Davesworld wrote:
Download and install Google maps and see what happens.


Davesworld, And this worked for you ?  


BAT

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Mar 24, 2008 3:23:19 PM
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Luckey wrote:


jayeye wrote:
I just got the AT&T data service, along with a Sierra Wireless 881U.  The specs from SW claim that the 881U has GPS capabilities.  How does one access them?
 
Thanks


GPS is not active on the device.


What he said...err...I said earlier.  GPS is not active on the Sierra Wireless 881 or AT&T USBConnect 881.


Luckey wrote:


jayeye wrote:
I just got the AT&T data service, along with a Sierra Wireless 881U.  The specs from SW claim that the 881U has GPS capabilities.  How does one access them?
 
Thanks


GPS is not active on the device.


What he said...err...I said earlier.  GPS is not active on the Sierra Wireless 881 or AT&T USBConnect 881.

Re: GPS on an 881U ?

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