Data plan with unlocked phone

Scholar

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

 


dmapr wrote:
I was only stressing the importance of the word designated in the T&C. I'm not talking about fighting a data plan on a designated smartphone, I'm talking about fighting a data plan on a non-designated smartphone. If AT&T T&C stated that data plans are mandatory for all smartphones we wouldn't be having this argument. As long as English doesn't equate designated with all we have a case. Oh, and good luck adding a smartphone data plan to my Blue account Smiley Tongue

 

 

Based on speaking with many people that have dealt with this issue and AT&T (including my self) here is my best understanding of how it really works regardless of any debate over wording in the AT&T published policy. You call AT&T and say "I gots a new phone! Heres my IME number." THey stick that IME number in their computers, and it spits back what plans are options for it. The rep on the phone then offers you what ever is on the screen. The same computer database is being used by their sniffer programs that are watching for people"cheating" the system by using a smart phone with out "proper" plan.

 

So its only considered a smart phone if the IME is registered in their DB as a smart phone. Thats the sole condition that matters in any practical sense. Their database apparently sucks since I know of multiple with the SAME PHONE being given every possible different level of plan, including NO plan. For example I with my Nexus One was given the option to drop data , even though *I* told them it was a smartphone, since the IME was not in their DB, that trumped all things. Now I wanted the data plan, so I got it anyways, but I have the option that makes no sense since many others were told the opposite about their Nexus Ones. 

 

In addition by requesting the Data Block service many have gotten out of the plan, and the AT&T retention specialists also have the ability to wave this plan requirement on the fly. 

 

That, IMO, is much less clear then the published terms, which tell me that my Nexus One should require the plan, but eh, life rarely makes sense... Smiley Happy 

Message 31 of 114
Master

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

 


VydorScope wrote:

 


dmapr wrote:
I was only stressing the importance of the word designated in the T&C. I'm not talking about fighting a data plan on a designated smartphone, I'm talking about fighting a data plan on a non-designated smartphone. If AT&T T&C stated that data plans are mandatory for all smartphones we wouldn't be having this argument. As long as English doesn't equate designated with all we have a case. Oh, and good luck adding a smartphone data plan to my Blue account Smiley Tongue

 

 

Based on speaking with many people that have dealt with this issue and AT&T (including my self) here is my best understanding of how it really works regardless of any debate over wording in the AT&T published policy. You call AT&T and say "I gots a new phone! Heres my IME number." THey stick that IME number in their computers, and it spits back what plans are options for it. The rep on the phone then offers you what ever is on the screen. The same computer database is being used by their sniffer programs that are watching for people"cheating" the system by using a smart phone with out "proper" plan.

 

So its only considered a smart phone if the IME is registered in their DB as a smart phone. Thats the sole condition that matters in any practical sense. Their database apparently sucks since I know of multiple with the SAME PHONE being given every possible different level of plan, including NO plan. For example I with my Nexus One was given the option to drop data , even though *I* told them it was a smartphone, since the IME was not in their DB, that trumped all things. Now I wanted the data plan, so I got it anyways, but I have the option that makes no sense since many others were told the opposite about their Nexus Ones. 

 

In addition by requesting the Data Block service many have gotten out of the plan, and the AT&T retention specialists also have the ability to wave this plan requirement on the fly. 

 

That, IMO, is much less clear then the published terms, which tell me that my Nexus One should require the plan, but eh, life rarely makes sense... Smiley Happy 


 

I take the opposite viewpoint. Smiley Happy

 

I'm certain at&t has a team of legal staff that write/review their terms of service.  At&t's terms of service can be written however they choose - so I have to believe that what is written *is* what is intended (i.e. "designated smartphones", not "smartphones" - "designated" is a qualifier which limits the universe).  As if it is not, they also have the ability to change the wording at any point in time.

 

No surprise re: the varied experiences of users - even including the lack of consistency from at&t themselves.  That's no different than it is with any issue a customer contacts at&t regarding - yet it is the best reason to look to the terms of service for the ultimate authority, imo.  So far, the Nexus One is the only non-at&t model that I've seen a grey-book comment regarding.  There was a moderator post made out here that indicates the smartphone data plan is required on the Nexus One and that it may be required for similar devices in the future.

 

And in my experience the way it "works" is that there is no need to contact at&t to let them know you've gotten a new device. Smiley Wink  Simply move your existing SIM to the new device and begin using it.  The only reason to contact at&t would be to change the covered device for insurance/warranty purposes (doesn't apply to non-at&t branded devices) or if content isn't being delivered to your new device properly (probably not an issue for smartphone users who want cellular data blocked).  Does at&t know what device you are using?  Ultimately they do have the IMEI # as it is delivered by the phone to the network every time a connection is established; but as you state, whether at&t can associate a model with that IMEI # is based on their database, which is likely only comprised of at&t branded devices.

                                                                                                                         =^..^=
There must be a happy medium somewhere between being totally informed and blissfully unaware.

     - Doug Larson

Message 32 of 114
Scholar

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

Yes they have a team of legal, and all that... and yes they can 


hme83 wrote:

 


VydorScope wrote:

 

Based on speaking with many people that have dealt with this issue and AT&T (including my self) here is my best understanding of how it really works regardless of any debate over wording in the AT&T published policy. You call AT&T and say "I gots a new phone! Heres my IME number." THey stick that IME number in their computers, and it spits back what plans are options for it. The rep on the phone then offers you what ever is on the screen. The same computer database is being used by their sniffer programs that are watching for people"cheating" the system by using a smart phone with out "proper" plan.

 

So its only considered a smart phone if the IME is registered in their DB as a smart phone. Thats the sole condition that matters in any practical sense. Their database apparently sucks since I know of multiple with the SAME PHONE being given every possible different level of plan, including NO plan. For example I with my Nexus One was given the option to drop data , even though *I* told them it was a smartphone, since the IME was not in their DB, that trumped all things. Now I wanted the data plan, so I got it anyways, but I have the option that makes no sense since many others were told the opposite about their Nexus Ones. 

 

In addition by requesting the Data Block service many have gotten out of the plan, and the AT&T retention specialists also have the ability to wave this plan requirement on the fly. 

 

That, IMO, is much less clear then the published terms, which tell me that my Nexus One should require the plan, but eh, life rarely makes sense... Smiley Happy 


 

I take the opposite viewpoint. Smiley Happy

 

I'm certain at&t has a team of legal staff that write/review their terms of service.  At&t's terms of service can be written however they choose - so I have to believe that what is written *is* what is intended (i.e. "designated smartphones", not "smartphones" - "designated" is a qualifier which limits the universe).  As if it is not, they also have the ability to change the wording at any point in time.

 

No surprise re: the varied experiences of users - even including the lack of consistency from at&t themselves.  That's no different than it is with any issue a customer contacts at&t regarding - yet it is the best reason to look to the terms of service for the ultimate authority, imo.  So far, the Nexus One is the only non-at&t model that I've seen a grey-book comment regarding.  There was a moderator post made out here that indicates the smartphone data plan is required on the Nexus One and that it may be required for similar devices in the future.

 

And in my experience the way it "works" is that there is no need to contact at&t to let them know you've gotten a new device. Smiley Wink  Simply move your existing SIM to the new device and begin using it.  The only reason to contact at&t would be to change the covered device for insurance/warranty purposes (doesn't apply to non-at&t branded devices) or if content isn't being delivered to your new device properly (probably not an issue for smartphone users who want cellular data blocked).  Does at&t know what device you are using?  Ultimately they do have the IMEI # as it is delivered by the phone to the network every time a connection is established; but as you state, whether at&t can associate a model with that IMEI # is based on their database, which is likely only comprised of at&t branded devices.


 

 

You are right, they can detect you with out you calling them, thats  given but you can not debate/ask for different plan/etc them unless you call in so that was not worth mentioning. Smiley Happy I HAVE seen posts from people with BRANDED phones (On AT&T Facebook page specifically, phones purchased directly from AT&T even) that have gotten out of the requirement through the means I mentioned. So I would not agree that only Nexus is "grey" area. 

 

And yes sometimes you do need to contact them about a new phone. I contacted AT&T because I switched from a Blackberry which has a BIS account/etc associated with it that needed to be closed/etc. Had I switched to a blackberry (like I did a few years ago), I would have to get the Blackberry stuff turned on. Plus I changed my plan at the same time, but I had the phone a few days first to make sure I was keeping it. 

 

The TOS should be the definitive source, but in AT&T land its not that way presently. 

Message 33 of 114
Master

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone


VydorScope wrote:

Yes they have a team of legal, and all that... and yes they can 

..............................

 

You are right, they can detect you with out you calling them, thats  given but you can not debate/ask for different plan/etc them unless you call in so that was not worth mentioning. Smiley Happy  From what I've seen indicated in various places, given enough time the on-line system will "catch up" with the billing system and present the appropriate data plan choices based on the type of phone you are using.  The only caveat is where you've moved directly from an at&t branded smartphone (one which the system recognizes as being a smartphone) to a non-branded device.  Because at&t's system does not recognize the device, the "default" phone type seems to remain as "smartphone".  

 

I HAVE seen posts from people with BRANDED phones (On AT&T Facebook page specifically, phones purchased directly from AT&T even) that have gotten out of the requirement through the means I mentioned. So I would not agree that only Nexus is "grey" area.  Good to know - I don't recall having seen indication of that situation.  But I have seen a number of users state they've had non-at&t branded devices and been given a "pass" on the data plan if their line of service was not currently under contract (i.e. so there was no continuing obligation or "buyout" for at&t to leverage in not waiving the data plan requirement); but based on just the general inconsistency in user experiences I'm certainly not surprised to hear there may even be examples of more generous treatment than that as well.  Sorry - my "grey-book" statement only meant that the comment source - while somewhat "authoritative" imo - was still coming from less than the "highest" level of authority - i.e. at&t's publicly stated terms of service. Smiley Wink 

 

And yes sometimes you do need to contact them about a new phone. I contacted AT&T because I switched from a Blackberry which has a BIS account/etc associated with it that needed to be closed/etc. Had I switched to a blackberry (like I did a few years ago), I would have to get the Blackberry stuff turned on. Plus I changed my plan at the same time, but I had the phone a few days first to make sure I was keeping it. 

 

The TOS should be the definitive source, but in AT&T land its not that way presently.  My position is that if challenged, at&t's published terms of service *are* the definitive source, and especially where I can find no legally justifiable interest that the carrier has to protect in a situation where they've provided no equipment subsidy and the user wants to block cellular data access - but I'm not an attorney, and that is just my personal opinion. Smiley Happy 


 

                                                                                                                         =^..^=
There must be a happy medium somewhere between being totally informed and blissfully unaware.

     - Doug Larson

Message 34 of 114
Expert

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone


Irish Rose wrote:
     In order to avoid having the data plan added to your account, any smartphone that you buy would have to be unlocked as well as unbraned.

     This is the most recent list I ahve been able to come across for phones currently being listed as a smartphone (List is of ATTM devices as smartphones, there is a list of non-branded ATTM smartphones but cant find it at this time.) ("list is pending changes still to this date for additions")

  1. Apple iPhone 3GS (Any Version)
  2. BlackBerry (Any Version)
  3. Google Nexus One
  4. HITECH (Any Version)
  5. HP iPAQ Glisten
  6. LG Electronics eXpo (GW820)
  7. Motorola Q9
  8. Nokia 9300
  9. Nokia Surge (6790)
  10. Nokia E71x BLK
  11. Nokia E62
  12. Pantech Matrix Pro (C820)
  13. Palm (Any Version)
  14. Palm Pre Plus
  15. Palm Pixi Plus (Any Version)
  16. Palm 680 (Any Version)
  17. Samsung Jack (SGH-i637)
  18. Siemens SX66
  19. Samsung I607 BLK
  20. Samsung BlackJack II (Any Version)
Message 35 of 114

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

 


wilcre wrote:

Irish Rose wrote:
     In order to avoid having the data plan added to your account, any smartphone that you buy would have to be unlocked as well as unbraned.

     This is the most recent list I ahve been able to come across for phones currently being listed as a smartphone (List is of ATTM devices as smartphones, there is a list of non-branded ATTM smartphones but cant find it at this time.) ("list is pending changes still to this date for additions")

  1. Apple iPhone 3GS (Any Version)
  2. BlackBerry (Any Version)
  3. Google Nexus One
  4. HITECH (Any Version)
  5. HP iPAQ Glisten
  6. LG Electronics eXpo (GW820)
  7. Motorola Q9
  8. Nokia 9300
  9. Nokia Surge (6790)
  10. Nokia E71x BLK
  11. Nokia E62
  12. Pantech Matrix Pro (C820)
  13. Palm (Any Version)
  14. Palm Pre Plus
  15. Palm Pixi Plus (Any Version)
  16. Palm 680 (Any Version)
  17. Samsung Jack (SGH-i637)
  18. Siemens SX66
  19. Samsung I607 BLK
  20. Samsung BlackJack II (Any Version)

Isn't the Palm Pixi Plus only CDMA?  Otherwise, the list is pretty comprehensive.  Might I also suggest changing Hitech to HTC? 

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Samsung Galaxy Note 3
Prev. devices: SGS, Note 2, SGS3, Galaxy Nexus, T-Mobile, G2x, iPhone4, HTC HD2, HTC Fuze, HTC StarTrek, BB Bold
Message 36 of 114
Expert

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone


hidden_dragon wrote:

 


wilcre wrote:

Irish Rose wrote:
     In order to avoid having the data plan added to your account, any smartphone that you buy would have to be unlocked as well as unbraned.

     This is the most recent list I ahve been able to come across for phones currently being listed as a smartphone (List is of ATTM devices as smartphones, there is a list of non-branded ATTM smartphones but cant find it at this time.) ("list is pending changes still to this date for additions")

  1. Apple iPhone 3GS (Any Version)
  2. BlackBerry (Any Version)
  3. Google Nexus One
  4. HITECH (A.K.A:. HTC) (Any Version)
  5. HP iPAQ Glisten
  6. LG Electronics eXpo (GW820)
  7. Motorola Q9
  8. Nokia 9300
  9. Nokia Surge (6790)
  10. Nokia E71x BLK
  11. Nokia E62
  12. Pantech Matrix Pro (C820)
  13. Palm (Any Version)
  14. Palm Pre Plus
  15. Palm Pixi Plus (Any Version)
  16. Palm 680 (Any Version)
  17. Samsung Jack (SGH-i637)
  18. Siemens SX66
  19. Samsung I607 BLK
  20. Samsung BlackJack II (Any Version)

     Isn't the Palm Pixi Plus only CDMA? Otherwise, the list is pretty comprehensive.  Might I also suggest changing Hitech to HTC?


     Too late for me to edit the original, but did update the quote, and the Pixi Plus is a GSM version. http://www.gsmarena.com/palm_pre_plus-3249.php

Message 37 of 114
Guru

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

So, has anyone actually purchased an unlocked and unbranded smartphone and notified AT&T that they are now using it on their network?  If I buy a Nokia 5800 or other non-AT&T smartphone, put in my sim card and tell AT&T, will they add a data plan?  If I use that phone and do not tell AT&T will they add one if they notice what phone I have or let it go because it is not on the AT&T list? 

I read the "designated smartphone" as ANY phone deemed to be a smartphone, whether by the manufacturer or by AT&T.  I never read that term as being limited to ONLY those phones on the AT&T list.  Am I completely wrong here?

Message 38 of 114
Scholar

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

I purchased a Nexus One, which is the smartest phone that will work on AT&T, called them and told them, and I had the option to drop the data plan, which I turned down because I wanted it. 

Message 39 of 114

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

 


wilcre wrote:

     Too late for me to edit the original, but did update the quote, and the Pixi Plus is a GSM version. http://www.gsmarena.com/palm_pre_plus-3249.php


 

That link is for a Palm Pre Plus...not a Palm Pixi Plus.  The Pixi Plus only comes in a CDMA flavor.  http://www.phonescoop.com/phones/phone.php?p=2360

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Samsung Galaxy Note 3
Prev. devices: SGS, Note 2, SGS3, Galaxy Nexus, T-Mobile, G2x, iPhone4, HTC HD2, HTC Fuze, HTC StarTrek, BB Bold
Message 40 of 114

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

sorry my pos tis long and a little out of place b/c my phone is att branded, activated by original buyer - no mods, unlock, etc.

 

I think the buyer got out of thier contract, anyway it looks like att thinks i should be paying the subsidy off. gigiagia

 

oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

 

 

 

Lets review - for those who got an iphone and signed a contract with att, sorry, this does not apply so much to you

 

This is about people who had att service without a data plan then plugged thier sim into an iphone (or other smartphone, but I will just say iphone)

...and then att forced a data plan onto the account, and that is not right.  You try to have it removed and they say no, you must have it if you are using an iphone.

 

 

IT IS POSSIBLE

 

to have an iphone work as a normal phone (call and text, no data plan)

I know because I had it myself.  I had a razr2 and then bought an iphone on my own, NOT from att, NOT from apple, NOT from 'an authorized reseller', NOT with any contract of any kind.

 

I just took my sim out of the razr2 and stuck it into the iphone, and presto:

call worked, mms worked, wifi worked.  If I tried to use a data feature without wifi and iphone popped a message 'could not access cellular data network' or something to that effect.  good.

 

I still had my $40/mo 450 voice only plan.  I was a happy camper for about a month until 3am last saturday I was notified that a data plan was added...you all know that part well.

 

So this is to say that it can be done (iphone w/o data), but atts business model does not want it done.

 

So now I am trying to get the data plan removed, but it is an uphill battle.

 

CONTRACT

 

Now let me say say that one may argue that the contract states a data plan is required.

 

Yes atts current contract language reads:

 

 

"If itis determined that you are using an iPhone on youraccount without an eligible data plan, AT&T reserves the right to add an eligible data plan to your account and billyou the appropriate monthly fee."

 

My problem is that I signed my contract June 2008.  The above stipulation was written September 2009 ( http://forums.wireless.att.com/t5/MEdia-Net/Data-plans-on-smartphones-mandatory-as-of-Sept-6/td-p/18... )

 

So the agreement I entered into was made before the mandatory data stipulation.

 

Now one might refer to other language in the contract which states:

 

"We may change any terms, conditions, rates, fees, expenses, or charges regarding your service at any time."

 

That seems bogus.  It's like they can write whatever they feel and we must follow it.  Could they write something like 'by signing this you have no rights whatsoever'? Well, how about this bit in the contract:

 

"You agree that, by entering into this Agreement, you and AT&T are each waiving the right to a trial by jury"

 

..pretty close right?  Can att trump my right granted by 7th amendment of the constitution... with a wireless contract?

 

HERE IS MY POINT

 

It doesnt seem right that I enter a service agreement, get an iphone on my own, plug in the sim card (all legal and in agreement with the contract) and then without my consent att gives me a service I dont want and charges me for it.

 

I have been doing some reading and it looks like atts current business model IS to do whatever they please, legal or not, and see how much exploitation they can get away with until someone stops them.

 

The last contract quote about waiving your right to sue is key:

 

1) This is so att can strip you of your legal right to sue, making it easier for them do outrageous things.  You can't stop them if you cant sue them.  att has been ruled against in court for trying to take away the peoples right to sue.  The key word is 'unconscionable'.  If something in a contact is bogus (against contract writing law, constitution, other laws, unethical, impossible, etc)  a judge can rule that part of the contract UNCONSCIONABLE, and it does not have to be met.  Check out this from UCLA law review:

 

It talks about att pushing the legal limits of its contracts, then being fought by customers.  Since most of these battles are fought in arbitration (what you DO get as legal recousre in exchange for your right to sue, as explained in the contract) - att gets to see how far they can go without the pain of legal rulings (fyi arbitration is like going to the peace table in first grade - the 2 kids talk about what happened and make a deal while the teacher supervises - no one goes to the principal).

 

http://uclalawreview.org/pdf/57-3-1.pdf

 

2) THE BIG PICTURE - att is vying for control of the exploding wireless industry.  Their network is getting swamped by iphone users and they need more money.  THEY ARE ACTING UNETHICALLY, PURPOSELY PUSHING CUSTOMERS TOWARD ILLEGAL PRACTICES.  They are seeing how far they can go, and when a customer wins an arbitration (or better yet a suit) they know they cant push much further. SO IT IS OUR RESPONSIBILITY to fight back, to let att and everyone else know that they are exploiting us and it is wrong.  

 

Occasionally posters will post a comment siding with att ('read your contract dummy', 'if you dont like it leave', etc).  Those posting are good because they promote thought and discussion, but I'm trying to help everyone understand that att is not 100% right.  In fact, they are bullying and hoping everyone lies down and no one challenges them.  But they will lose some of those challenges because as many of you know in your hearts something is not right.  It's just hard to get at it and make it right.

 

...I know many (most?) of you reading this are just looking for a fair deal.  You would be happy if they just let you use your iphone as a phone with wifi.  If you are not using the data network whey should you be forced to pay for it?  I understand, but there is a deeper uglier thing going on.

 

This is the same strain of greedy corporate america.  I wish att (the top brass) could have a good vision for the future.  That is, sure they can be a pioneer in building a great wireless network, where eventually everyone can have access to communication and information, but they are killing it in its youth.  Instead of bullying customers who want cellular service into paying for things they dont want, why not let them keep what they have (like me - voice only and I happen to have wifi on my phone - Im not straing the celluar netowrk any more, so let me keep paying what im paying)?  Yeah they can get more money faster if they can get away with forcing service on people, but cmon,

 

Do you jsut want to see how much money you can snatch while you run around in a big ugly costume,

or do you want to do something great in this world?

 

Keep fighting for justice.

 

oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

<--    combining 2 consecutive posts  -->

oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

 

some more technical info / details

 

-quite a while back when i had my razr2 I asked for a DATA BLOCK, so that I wouldn;t get pinged when I accidentally hit the internet button on my phone and got charged by the kb.  Apparently this is not phone specific feature, because my iphone was still blocked form the data network.

 

THIS IS AN IMPORTANT PIECE OF THE PUZZLE - 

 

One of the original att/iphone problems was that many users had no data plan, but also did not have the data block like I did, so they were connecting and paying per - very expensive, many cust serv/billing problems, adn one of the official reasons of the current requirement.  Of course now you cna all know that if you have a data block like I did this is not an issue.  (att still wants your money though, so they do not want to do this...really where the battleground is IMO - give me the service I signed up for.  Just b/c the phone can do more doesnt me I want it to)

 

- When the data plan was forcibly added I got an email stating 

"For whatever reason, our records indicate your iPhone does not have an eligible data plan. We have added an appropriate data plan for your iPhone."

 

...'for whatever reason'  That is funny to me (in a bad way).  The reason is I never asked to buy a data plan. That is not professional business language.  A good business practice would be to call me and explain things, maybe give me the option to stop using the iphone - thats not what i want, but it is a much more ethical practice than what they do.

 

-  I called the day my data plan was added, trying to get it removed.  The first rep said they could not.  OK, I'm a computer person, I can understand of the person logged on doesn't have access to change that option.

 

So i got the supervisor.  *INTERSTING - he told me that sups do have access to turn off the data plan, BUT when that happens the computer makes a record of it - the sups who are listed as doing such "get fired" (yeah thats a quote).  Sound like more like unethical business?  I suppose that if the lines were clear (who is 'required to have a data plan', etc) then cust srv reps would have no problem doing whatever.  My guess is that att knows they are screwing me, and that I am right to ask the data plan be removed, so top brass threatens the employees - 'if you that your fired'.  So the people at the top who make the decision to exploit the customers to not have to carry out that exploitation.  The reps probably know its wrong too, but they are afraid to right the situation for fear of losing thier jobs.

 

..so the supervisor turned me over to the specialist team and I am waiting, about 4 days, no word yet.

 

-I figure that if things go as I hope that I will be back to using my iphone without a data plan, so today I called and tried to get the data block back on.

 

* I was not asking for the data plan to be removed - I knew the rep could not, the sup would not, and anyway I have a pending case that I will let the specialist team deal with.

 

No, I wanted data blocked, so that I can continue to use my iphone now without worrying about accidentally going online.  I want to be able to say that I never used the forced data plan..for future conversations 

 

anyway, The rep said that b/c I had the data plan that *the computer* would not allow the data bl;ock to be added.  I actually asked her to trying clicking through it and tell me what computer said.  She did and it was something like 'the data block feature is in conflict with the data plan feature'.  So for whatever that's worth.

 

 

ok thats a lot for now, it was good to get it all down - keep talking yall! (sorry for all the caps, formatting, parens, etc)

 

 

Message 41 of 114

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

some more technical info / details

 

-quite a while back when i had my razr2 I asked for a DATA BLOCK, so that I wouldn;t get pinged when I accidentally hit the internet button on my phone and got charged by the kb.  Apparently this is not phone specific feature, because my iphone was still blocked form the data network.

 

THIS IS AN IMPORTANT PIECE OF THE PUZZLE - 

 

One of the original att/iphone problems was that many users had no data plan, but also did not have the data block like I did, so they were connecting and paying per - very expensive, many cust serv/billing problems, adn one of the official reasons of the current requirement.  Of course now you cna all know that if you have a data block like I did this is not an issue.  (att still wants your money though, so they do not want to do this...really where the battleground is IMO - give me the service I signed up for.  Just b/c the phone can do more doesnt me I want it to)

 

- When the data plan was forcibly added I got an email stating 

"For whatever reason, our records indicate your iPhone does not have an eligible data plan. We have added an appropriate data plan for your iPhone."

 

...'for whatever reason'  That is funny to me (in a bad way).  The reason is I never asked to buy a data plan. That is not professional business language.  A good business practice would be to call me and explain things, maybe give me the option to stop using the iphone - thats not what i want, but it is a much more ethical practice than what they do.

 

-  I called the day my data plan was added, trying to get it removed.  The first rep said they could not.  OK, I'm a computer person, I can understand of the person logged on doesn't have access to change that option.

 

So i got the supervisor.  *INTERSTING - he told me that sups do have access to turn off the data plan, BUT when that happens the computer makes a record of it - the sups who are listed as doing such "get fired" (yeah thats a quote).  Sound like more like unethical business?  I suppose that if the lines were clear (who is 'required to have a data plan', etc) then cust srv reps would have no problem doing whatever.  My guess is that att knows they are screwing me, and that I am right to ask the data plan be removed, so top brass threatens the employees - 'if you that your fired'.  So the people at the top who make the decision to exploit the customers to not have to carry out that exploitation.  The reps probably know its wrong too, but they are afraid to right the situation for fear of losing thier jobs.

 

..so the supervisor turned me over to the specialist team and I am waiting, about 4 days, no word yet.

 

-I figure that if things go as I hope that I will be back to using my iphone without a data plan, so today I called and tried to get the data block back on.

 

* I was not asking for the data plan to be removed - I knew the rep could not, the sup would not, and anyway I have a pending case that I will let the specialist team deal with.

 

No, I wanted data blocked, so that I can continue to use my iphone now without worrying about accidentally going online.  I want to be able to say that I never used the forced data plan..for future conversations Smiley Wink

 

anyway, The rep said that b/c I had the data plan that *the computer* would not allow the data bl;ock to be added.  I actually asked her to trying clicking through it and tell me what computer said.  She did and it was something like 'the data block feature is in conflict with the data plan feature'.  So for whatever that's worth.

 

 

ok thats a lot for now, it was good to get it all down - keep talking yall! (sorry for all the caps, formatting, parens, etc)

Message 42 of 114

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

..fianl note I should say that 

 

my phone is att branded, activated by original buyer - no mods, unlock, etc.

 

I think the buyer got out of thier contract, anyway it looks like att thinks i should be paying the subsidy off. gigiagia

Message 43 of 114
Master

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

Sorry, dude, you can argue about legal and whether or not you should be forced to use the data plan when you don't want it and didn't purchase your phone from AT&T, but the Wireless Service Agreement has this to say:

 

You can accept the Service Agreement in several different ways: (i) by giving us your electronic signature via our website; (ii) by giving us your electronic signature over the phone through our automated phone consent process; (iii) by signing an electronic signature pad; (iv) in certain third party retail locations, by giving us your written signature; or (v) by using the wireless service after a modification to your service if you have been informed that continued use of the new service will mean you've given us your acceptance.

 

You were probably informed via your bill that the Feature Terms & Conditions and the Data Service Terms & Conditions were changing, and that your continued usage constituted acceptance.  You can't now complain that you didn't agree to the mandatory data plan if you activated a phone, regardless of where it was purchased, that required a data plan.

Message 44 of 114

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

All I did was plug my sim in and the iphone worked. I didn't activate it.

 

I dont get it - I've paid every bill for 5+ years.  I plug my sim into a different phone.  My usage stays the same - same call volume, same txt volume, still no data usage (remember I had a data block on my account).

 

I'm not really interested in arguing legal.  It seems pretty 'common sense/doing whats right' that if I'm using the same service my plan and bill should stay the same.

 

I wouldn't care about the legal, except thats how att tries to justify changing my plan.

 

I'll point out again that if they really want/ need to 

-1 know what model phone your sim is plugged into at all times

-2 knowing that that model is smart capable

-3 soemhow force you to have a data plan for such phones

 

...that they could go about it in a more civil and upstanding way.

 

Sticking my sim into an iphone then waking up in the morning to find a txt & email at 4am that I now have a data plan that nearly doubles my bill and which i must have - thats just dirty

 

Why no call, email, txt before changing my plan?  Why not let me know first?  

 

..Not that I would be any happier in the long run,  I'm just trying to emphasize that discussion I am trying to have is not just about legal details.

 

It is about a company acting in greed and doing it in a subversive way.

 

I just want the same service I always had, and that service does not involve which phone I use.

 

And I suspect that I'm speaking for a whole class of people.  I'm not one lone crazy person - the net is full of others with no law degree, but just a sense of right and wrong

Message 45 of 114
You must type a description before you click preview or reply.
Share this topic
Announcements

Are you looking to upgrade and activate your device?

Let us help make Ordering, Upgrading and Activating easy!

Additional Support