Data plan with unlocked phone

Master

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

[ Edited ]

 


PhoneScoop wrote:
It doesn't matter whether unlocked or unbranded. If the manufacturer deems that device as a "smartphone" therefore it is such. A smartphone is a smartphone no matter what carrier it is. Such as a rose is still a rose even if called by another name. A Ford is still a Ford even if you unbrand it by taking off all the dealer and manufacturer logos. You can call it a Toyota but in reality..it's still a Ford. A smartphone can be from another provider and be unlocked or "unbranded" (which unbranded only really means it doesn't have an AT&T or Cingular logo) but it's still a smartphone. Just someone tryna beat the system or actually proving a VALID point by finding a loophole in the terms of service. Nothing like finding a loophole is it.{Uncalled for comment edited}

 

You don't know what you are even talking about here, and make absolutely no sense at all. So by your logic here, EVERYONE that is using an unbranded and unlocked smartphone is just trying to beat the system?  You seem to be forgetting that not everyone wants to be locked down to a device that they don't like, or care for. *cough* *cough* Like AT&T's so called first Android phone, which just happens to be the only one that AT&T sells........ {Uncalled for comment edited} 

 

Message 16 of 114 (16,276 Views)
Scholar

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

[ Edited ]

 


Irish Rose wrote:

 


PhoneScoop wrote:
It doesn't matter whether unlocked or unbranded. If the manufacturer deems that device as a "smartphone" therefore it is such. A smartphone is a smartphone no matter what carrier it is. Such as a rose is still a rose even if called by another name. A Ford is still a Ford even if you unbrand it by taking off all the dealer and manufacturer logos. You can call it a Toyota but in reality..it's still a Ford. A smartphone can be from another provider and be unlocked or "unbranded" (which unbranded only really means it doesn't have an AT&T or Cingular logo) but it's still a smartphone. Just someone tryna beat the system or actually proving a VALID point by finding a loophole in the terms of service. Nothing like finding a loophole is it. {Uncalled for comment edited}

 

You don't know what you are even talking about here, and make absolutely no sense at all. So by your logic here, EVERYONE that is using an unbranded and unlocked smartphone is just trying to beat the system?  You seem to be forgetting that not everyone wants to be locked down to a device that they don't like, or care for. *cough* *cough* Like AT&T's so called first Android phone, which really isn't an Android device at all........ {Uncalled for comment edited} 

 


 

No, he is pointing out clearly that a smart phone is a smart phone regardless if its unbranded/unlocked/etc. Branding and Locking are not conditions of the agreement, only the designation "smart"

 

Now, its really a totally pointless debate because in practice there appears to be no rhyme or reason to whether or not they require the data plan or not when you call up with any given phone. Smiley Happy

 

Of course if you want to say its a horrible policy, with an even worse execution, I would be in complete agreement. Smiley Happy 

Message 17 of 114 (16,268 Views)
Master

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

 


VydorScope wrote:
No, he is pointing out clearly that a smart phone is a smart phone regardless if its unbranded/unlocked/etc. Branding and Locking are not conditions of the agreement, only the designation "smart"

 

Now, its really a totally pointless debate because in practice there appears to be no rhyme or reason to whether or not they require the data plan or not when you call up with any given phone. Smiley Happy

 

Of course if you want to say its a horrible policy, with an even worse execution, I would be in complete agreement. Smiley Happy 


Besides the fact that I disagree with the policy, or the fact that it leaves a lot to question, what was said above about the only reason why someone would own an unbranded and unlocked device is to "beat the system", is false. 

 

Message 18 of 114 (16,261 Views)
Professor

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

[ Edited ]

PhoneScoop wrote:

Irish Rose wrote:

 


VydorScope wrote:

It has been posted a bunch of times on these forums already, its on their website and its in the contract you agree to when you get service now. I find it hard to believe you actually looked if you have not seen it. 

 

From their terms of service... 

 

Data Plans: An eligible data plan is required for certain devices, including iPhones and other designated smartphones. Eligible data plans cover data usage in the U.S. and do not cover international data usage and charges. If it is determined that you are using an iPhone or other designated smartphone without an eligible data plan, AT&T reserves the right to add an eligible data plan to your account and bill you the appropriate monthly fee.

 

Simply put anything they designate a smartphone requires the data plan. Pure and simple. However enforcement is very much in variance. 


Yup, I saw this, now show me where in that paragraph, where it says that "unlocked & unbranded" devices are designated as smartphones and require a data plan. Ya know what? You can't, because it's NOT there, period!!! Smiley Wink

 


It doesn't matter whether unlocked or unbranded. If the manufacturer deems that device as a "smartphone" therefore it is such. A smartphone is a smartphone no matter what carrier it is. Such as a rose is still a rose even if called by another name. A Ford is still a Ford even if you unbrand it by taking off all the dealer and manufacturer logos. You can call it a Toyota but in reality..it's still a Ford. A smartphone can be from another provider and be unlocked or "unbranded" (which unbranded only really means it doesn't have an AT&T or Cingular logo) but it's still a smartphone. Just someone tryna beat the system or actually proving a VALID point by finding a loophole in the terms of service. Nothing like finding a loophole is it. {Uncalled for comment edited}


 

 

 


While it is pretty obvious what the intent is, there is still lacks a certain degree of clarity. Consider what AT&T says is a smartphone in the answer center;

 

http://www.wireless.att.com/answer-center/main.jsp?t=solutionTab&ft=searchTab&ps=solutionPanels&loca...

 

The problem is the line has become blurred. You can look at some of the Quick Messaging Devices and find that they exhibit many, if not all, of the characteristics of a smartphone. Some even have full HTML browsers. I had a rep tell me,  before the Nov 1 switching rule went into effect, that data blocks would be allowed on place of the $30 data plan for non subsidized phones. I have seen posts here where there a cases that this has been allowed. However, there is nothing official from AT&T. Some simple statements detailing this and if phones classified by other carriers will be classified the same by AT&T would go ways in helping with the clarity issue. As it stands now, I'm still waiting to see that full list of designated devices, not just the list of devices they sell.

Message 19 of 114 (16,211 Views)

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

The biggest issue at hand is how broad is ATT's definition of "smartphone" and how long till "Insert name of phone here" is considered a smartphone and thus requiring the $30 data plan.

 


I am an AT&T employee and the postings on this site are my own and don’t necessarily represent AT&T’s positions, strategies or opinions.
Message 20 of 114 (16,184 Views)

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone


Irish Rose wrote:

 


PhoneScoop wrote:
It doesn't matter whether unlocked or unbranded. If the manufacturer deems that device as a "smartphone" therefore it is such. A smartphone is a smartphone no matter what carrier it is. Such as a rose is still a rose even if called by another name. A Ford is still a Ford even if you unbrand it by taking off all the dealer and manufacturer logos. You can call it a Toyota but in reality..it's still a Ford. A smartphone can be from another provider and be unlocked or "unbranded" (which unbranded only really means it doesn't have an AT&T or Cingular logo) but it's still a smartphone. Just someone tryna beat the system or actually proving a VALID point by finding a loophole in the terms of service. Nothing like finding a loophole is it.{Uncalled for comment edited}

 

You don't know what you are even talking about here, and make absolutely no sense at all. So by your logic here, EVERYONE that is using an unbranded and unlocked smartphone is just trying to beat the system?  You seem to be forgetting that not everyone wants to be locked down to a device that they don't like, or care for. *cough* *cough* Like AT&T's so called first Android phone, which just happens to be the only one that AT&T sells........ {Uncalled for comment edited} 

 


I actually make GREAT sense. COMMON Sense @ that. It's the manufacturers who deem these phones as smartphones, not the carriers. Blame them, not ANY carrier let alone AT&T. No where in my post did it reference ANYONE trying to beat the system. If anyone feels guilty or offended by my original msg, then apparently the shoe fits and they "may" have been trying to do so, but I never said it. I never even made mention of it. The only thing I said is everyone is saying it's AT&T who deems the phones as smartphones but it's not. A truck is deemed a truck by society. It is deemed a Ford by the manufacturer so society can either accept it as a Ford or say otherwise. That's a great reference in my opinion. We all should direct our focus to the manufacturers to provide phones that match the characteristics of these "wanted smartphones" but are deemed as basic phones to prevent the providers from "milking us" by "forcing" unwanted data plans down our throats. Apparently no change will come til the manufactuers' pockets are hurt because no one will buy their phones & they'll make changes to either the phones or the carriers they supply them to.

 


I am an AT&T employee and the postings on this site are my own and don’t necessarily represent AT&T’s positions, strategies or opinions.
Message 21 of 114 (15,347 Views)
ACE - Expert

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

[ Edited ]

PhoneScoop wrote:

 

I actually make GREAT sense. COMMON Sense @ that. It's the manufacturers who deem these phones as smartphones, not the carriers. Blame them, not ANY carrier let alone AT&T. No where in my post did it reference ANYONE trying to beat the system. If anyone feels guilty or offended by my original msg, then apparently the shoe fits and they "may" have been trying to do so, but I never said it. I never even made mention of it. The only thing I said is everyone is saying it's AT&T who deems the phones as smartphones but it's not. A truck is deemed a truck by society. It is deemed a Ford by the manufacturer so society can either accept it as a Ford or say otherwise. That's a great reference in my opinion. We all should direct our focus to the manufacturers to provide phones that match the characteristics of these "wanted smartphones" but are deemed as basic phones to prevent the providers from "milking us" by "forcing" unwanted data plans down our throats. Apparently no change will come til the manufactuers' pockets are hurt because no one will buy their phones & they'll make changes to either the phones or the carriers they supply them to.


My take on the matter is that it doesn't matter whether the phone is considered a smartphone by the manufacturer, AT&T or anyone else. What matters is that the wording is “designated smartphones”, not “smartphones”, “all smartphones” and so on. So as long as the word designated stays it means that the phones not explicitly on the designated list are not subject to these terms. Since you brought up the car analogy — a hybrid is a hybrid and Toyota Prius is a hybrid, yet only designated hybrids are exempt from the carpool lane restrictions in California. Drive there in a non-designated Toyota Prius next to a designated one and good luck fighting the ticket…

 

*The views and opinions expressed on this forum are purely my own. Any product claim, statistic, quote, or other representation about a product or service should be verified with the manufacturer, provider, or party.
Message 22 of 114 (15,343 Views)

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone


dmapr wrote:

PhoneScoop wrote:

 

I actually make GREAT sense. COMMON Sense @ that. It's the manufacturers who deem these phones as smartphones, not the carriers. Blame them, not ANY carrier let alone AT&T. No where in my post did it reference ANYONE trying to beat the system. If anyone feels guilty or offended by my original msg, then apparently the shoe fits and they "may" have been trying to do so, but I never said it. I never even made mention of it. The only thing I said is everyone is saying it's AT&T who deems the phones as smartphones but it's not. A truck is deemed a truck by society. It is deemed a Ford by the manufacturer so society can either accept it as a Ford or say otherwise. That's a great reference in my opinion. We all should direct our focus to the manufacturers to provide phones that match the characteristics of these "wanted smartphones" but are deemed as basic phones to prevent the providers from "milking us" by "forcing" unwanted data plans down our throats. Apparently no change will come til the manufactuers' pockets are hurt because no one will buy their phones & they'll make changes to either the phones or the carriers they supply them to.


My take on the matter is that it doesn't matter whether the phone is considered a smartphone by the manufacturer, AT&T or anyone else. What matters is that the wording is “designated smartphones”, not “smartphones”, “all smartphones” and so on. So as long as the word designated stays it means that the phones not explicitly on the designated list are not subject to these terms. Since you brought up the car analogy — a hybrid is a hybrid and Toyota Prius is a hybrid, yet only designated hybrids are exempt from the carpool lane restrictions in California. Drive there in a non-designated Toyota Prius next to a designated one and good luck fighting the ticket…

 


What the heck is this car analogy. I used something basic and you come up with something from left center field lmbo. But in that case, same as the mandatory data plan requirement. While Toyota DESIGNATES the Prius as a hybrid, many say it's just a "car". So although some may not use it as a hybrid, it is still a hybrid right or wrong. But if Toyota Prius's are designated hybrids, why would it matter about one being designated or not. And also, this is CA we're talking about. The land of the infamous "plea" commercials for people to come and stimulate the economy of the POOR state that can't pay their debts. You're talking a somewhat different analogy here believe or most likely you won't. Good luck fighting the data plan on a DESIGNATED smartphone.

 


I am an AT&T employee and the postings on this site are my own and don’t necessarily represent AT&T’s positions, strategies or opinions.
Message 23 of 114 (15,328 Views)
Contributor

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

Today I and my couple of friends got sms regarding data plan.  I am using iphone from more than an year.

Well I bought it on ebay and my friend his contract is over.  The another friend he bought for full price.  So we all dont have data plan.  I guess we just use them without internet. 

 

Now the sms from at&t says we are charging you from yesterday!  and all iphones need to have data plans Smiley Very Happy

 

I am getting laugh.  Well from when at&t decided this?   If I had taken smart phone from at&t then I will take the data plan.  Otherwise I dont need it.   At&t cannot decide what phone I am going to have and they should simply offer plan when a customer already has a smart phone already.

 

I guess the mind is working fast how to extract money.   So i have inquired and tmobile has not such thing.

 

So I will make sure that At&t dont charge me for one month and will change the sim to old phone.

Will wait for one month to see if there is any change of policy.  I guess will give some time for them.  Otherwise they will lose customers, who were there from more than 6 years.  Normally I dont switch company but I guess its time for that.   I will also make sure that all my friends know about it.  

 

Mister Steve jobs and at&t have become smarter in extracting money.  haha but it wont work with me.

I will make sure this kind of things gets eliminated in free market.  Those who reads this please change your plan to Tmobile or verizon.  They dont have any such constraints.   Fight against this kind of forced charging...

 

bye

 

 

 

Message 24 of 114 (15,306 Views)
Scholar

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

Actually I am pretty sure TMobile does, and I know for a fact Verizon does... 

Message 25 of 114 (15,296 Views)
Master

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

[ Edited ]

 


VydorScope wrote:

Actually I am pretty sure TMobile does, and I know for a fact Verizon does... 


Correct - the way I see things at&t's policy isn't any different than T-Mo's (or Verizon's for that matter).  At&t only "designates" the models that they carry as being smartphones and the terms of service state that the mandatory data plan requirement applies to "designated" smartphones.  T-Mo requires the smartphone data plan only for their own branded models.  So the policies are the same from where I sit.  (And to my knowledge it's difficult to bring your own device to Verizon so their policy is inherently virtually the same as well.)

 

                                                                                                                         =^..^=
There must be a happy medium somewhere between being totally informed and blissfully unaware.

     - Doug Larson

Message 26 of 114 (15,290 Views)
Guru

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone


srinidhi1234 wrote:

Today I and my couple of friends got sms regarding data plan.  I am using iphone from more than an year.

Well I bought it on ebay and my friend his contract is over.  The another friend he bought for full price.  So we all dont have data plan.  I guess we just use them without internet. 

 

Now the sms from at&t says we are charging you from yesterday!  and all iphones need to have data plans Smiley Very Happy

 

I am getting laugh.  Well from when at&t decided this?   If I had taken smart phone from at&t then I will take the data plan.  Otherwise I dont need it.   At&t cannot decide what phone I am going to have and they should simply offer plan when a customer already has a smart phone already.

 

I guess the mind is working fast how to extract money.   So i have inquired and tmobile has not such thing.

 

So I will make sure that At&t dont charge me for one month and will change the sim to old phone.

Will wait for one month to see if there is any change of policy.  I guess will give some time for them.  Otherwise they will lose customers, who were there from more than 6 years.  Normally I dont switch company but I guess its time for that.   I will also make sure that all my friends know about it.  

 

Mister Steve jobs and at&t have become smarter in extracting money.  haha but it wont work with me.

I will make sure this kind of things gets eliminated in free market.  Those who reads this please change your plan to Tmobile or verizon.  They dont have any such constraints.   Fight against this kind of forced charging...

 

bye

 

 

 


The iPhones have ALWAYS required the Data Plan with AT&T, since the 1st gen one, you just got caught because you was using an iPhone without it, that's all.

 

Doesn't matter if you buy it from eBay, craiglist, etc. You're using an iPhone, you pay for the Data Plan. Period.

 

You don't need or want data? Don't use an iPhone.

 


I am an AT&T employee and the postings on this site are my own and don’t necessarily represent AT&T’s positions, strategies or opinions.
Message 27 of 114 (15,276 Views)
Mentor

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

nice why is everyone so touchy this smartphone stuff. make this forum funny at least

Message 28 of 114 (15,263 Views)
ACE - Expert

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone


PhoneScoop wrote:

dmapr wrote:

What the heck is this car analogy. I used something basic and you come up with something from left center field lmbo. But in that case, same as the mandatory data plan requirement. While Toyota DESIGNATES the Prius as a hybrid, many say it's just a "car". So although some may not use it as a hybrid, it is still a hybrid right or wrong. But if Toyota Prius's are designated hybrids, why would it matter about one being designated or not. And also, this is CA we're talking about. The land of the infamous "plea" commercials for people to come and stimulate the economy of the POOR state that can't pay their debts. You're talking a somewhat different analogy here believe or most likely you won't. Good luck fighting the data plan on a DESIGNATED smartphone.


I was only stressing the importance of the word designated in the T&C. I'm not talking about fighting a data plan on a designated smartphone, I'm talking about fighting a data plan on a non-designated smartphone. If AT&T T&C stated that data plans are mandatory for all smartphones we wouldn't be having this argument. As long as English doesn't equate designated with all we have a case. Oh, and good luck adding a smartphone data plan to my Blue account Smiley Tongue

*The views and opinions expressed on this forum are purely my own. Any product claim, statistic, quote, or other representation about a product or service should be verified with the manufacturer, provider, or party.
Message 29 of 114 (15,208 Views)
Master

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

[ Edited ]

PhoneScoop wrote:
I actually make GREAT sense. COMMON Sense @ that. It's the manufacturers who deem these phones as smartphones, not the carriers. Blame them, not ANY carrier let alone AT&T. No where in my post did it reference ANYONE trying to beat the system. If anyone feels guilty or offended by my original msg, then apparently the shoe fits and they "may" have been trying to do so, but I never said it. I never even made mention of it. The only thing I said is everyone is saying it's AT&T who deems the phones as smartphones but it's not. A truck is deemed a truck by society. It is deemed a Ford by the manufacturer so society can either accept it as a Ford or say otherwise. That's a great reference in my opinion. We all should direct our focus to the manufacturers to provide phones that match the characteristics of these "wanted smartphones" but are deemed as basic phones to prevent the providers from "milking us" by "forcing" unwanted data plans down our throats. Apparently no change will come til the manufactuers' pockets are hurt because no one will buy their phones & they'll make changes to either the phones or the carriers they supply them to.

Actually I would disagree - Nokia defined the N75 as "a smart multimedia 3G folding phone" and they defined the 6650 as "a GSM/WCDMA dual mode portable multimedia computer".  Both are fairly recent Symbian devices carried by at&t - yet at&t also classified both as a feature phone.  The manufacturer may have their own definition re: what comprises a "smartphone" - but the carrier's classification can obviously be different. Smiley Wink 

                                                                                                                         =^..^=
There must be a happy medium somewhere between being totally informed and blissfully unaware.

     - Doug Larson

Message 30 of 114 (15,204 Views)
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