Data plan with unlocked phone

Expert

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone


antiscam wrote:

wingrider01 wrote:

antiscam wrote:

I think some of the posters here have been well trained to miss the point (especially the AT&T employees).

 

Repetitious recitals of what the TOS states is not helpful. The stated requirement that

    "... a data plan is required to use this phone..."

can be understood by anyone who takes the time to read it.

 

The question is-- why is that a requirement when it is NOT TRUE. If you can get a smartphone, pop in your SIM, operate the phone as you desire and most importantly, not use DATA, why are you forced to pay for a data plan? Why are the monopolies allowed to perpetrate this scam is the question?

 

If the phone you desire absolutely required a data connection to operate, then you do the obvious and pay for a data plan. If the phone did not require a data plan but you wanted it anyway, then you pay for a data plan.

 

If the phone does not require a data plan to operate and you do not want a data plan, then you should not be forced into a data plan. To be forced into a data plan because the providers simply say it is required is an obvious SCAM. Is there an additional cost to them if I use a smartphone? Is their network over worked or taxed in some way?  If yes, then it would be fair to pay extra.

 

Is the cost of my cell usage dependent on the phone I use or is it dependent on how I use my phone? It appears that the providers have found a way to tack on senseless charges to the customer and have gotten away with it. So far. 

 

[Per Guidelines:  Keep it Relevant and Appropriate].

 

Please don't waste time responding about what the microscopic fine print in the TOS says, because it is downright wrong and not germane to the discussion. 

 

One other point... The original OP's (Jesse) analogies were fantastic -- being forced into HD television service simply because you bought an HD TV.  By extension of this analogy, you either listened to a transistor radio or bought an HD TV and paid exorbitant service fees simply because the cable company had no competetion and could get away with it. Would that be right? Or how about you either buy a Lexus and be forced to pay through the nose for elevated premium gas -- or ride a bicycle. Nobody recognized the relevance of these analogies.

 

Thanks


the thing you are missing - their network, their rules. Period, same with a car, you purchase one, pay cash for it or finance it insurance is required for you to legally take it off the lot, and license it.

 

There is no tier 1 to 3 carrier that will allow you to install a smartphone on their network without the required data plan. Don't single out any carrier they all do it, don;t care for the requirement then don;t get a smartphone, [Per Guidelines:  Keep it Relevant and Appropriate].

 

This has to be the most amusing portion of your statement

 

"Please don't waste time responding about what the microscopic fine print in the TOS says, because it is downright wrong and not germane to the discussion. "

 

Since it is a LEGALLY binding agreement it is quite central to the discussion, if you don;t take the time to read it, then what ever happens is no ones fault but your own. It is your "opinion" that it is wrong, it is what is in place at this time at ALL the top tier carriers

 

 


I haven't singled out any providers, have I? I haven't changed providers since the 90's. Through various mergers, aquisitions, name changing etc, I've been with ATT for that long and that's why I'm writing here. Don't be insulted. PERIOD.

 

There you go again -- that misuse of the word "requirement" that results in a SCAM.

 

You haven't addressed any issue that I brought up. PERIOD. Thank you for trying though Wing.

 

 



guess we have different diffenitions and applications of the word "scam" what you are complainging about does not fit the websters english dictionary's definition. Last time I looked being honest is not a insult, if is basicly your fault for any unexpected results if you do not take the time to review the legal terms of service.

 

If you want to match times with ATT, can do that with you although I suspect I have abouty 10-15 years on you, back to the early 80's before the court ordered break up, if you add POTS services into the mix, it will take it back to the 50's

Message 106 of 114
Contributor

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

If ATT is quick and smart to add the data plan if someone uses an unlocked iPhone..they should be equally quick to remove it back when one changes back to a Non-Smart Phone.

 

Or is this mentioned in the T&C's that the data plan will be added but won't be taken back.

 

 I'm cancelling my U-Verse connection today and would have done the same with wireless but for the high termination fees. 

Message 107 of 114
Tutor

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone


wingrider01 wrote:

guess we have different diffenitions and applications of the word "scam" what you are complainging about does not fit the websters english dictionary's definition. Last time I looked being honest is not a insult, if is basicly your fault for any unexpected results if you do not take the time to review the legal terms of service.

 

If you want to match times with ATT, can do that with you although I suspect I have abouty 10-15 years on you, back to the early 80's before the court ordered break up, if you add POTS services into the mix, it will take it back to the 50's


Mirriam Webster Online Dictionary -- SCAM: a fraudulent or deceptive act or operation       Fraudulent: SYN - dishonest, false

 

Providers stating that a data plan is required is not true. It is False. By stating these falsehoods, it is a deceptive act to obtain more money from customers when it is not necessary. We can operate the phones without a data plan. The key issue here is the definition of "required". A data plan is not required. It may be desired or useful, but it is not required to operate the phone.

 

Why some have difficulty understanding that many customers do not want to spend additional money for a service that is not desired and most importantly is not required is beyond me. No one shold be defending that practice.

 

Thanks

Message 108 of 114
Expert

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone


antiscam wrote:

wingrider01 wrote:

guess we have different diffenitions and applications of the word "scam" what you are complainging about does not fit the websters english dictionary's definition. Last time I looked being honest is not a insult, if is basicly your fault for any unexpected results if you do not take the time to review the legal terms of service.

 

If you want to match times with ATT, can do that with you although I suspect I have abouty 10-15 years on you, back to the early 80's before the court ordered break up, if you add POTS services into the mix, it will take it back to the 50's


Mirriam Webster Online Dictionary -- SCAM: a fraudulent or deceptive act or operation       Fraudulent: SYN - dishonest, false

 

Providers stating that a data plan is required is not true. It is False. By stating these falsehoods, it is a deceptive act to obtain more money from customers when it is not necessary. We can operate the phones without a data plan. The key issue here is the definition of "required". A data plan is not required. It may be desired or useful, but it is not required to operate the phone.

 

Why some have difficulty understanding that many customers do not want to spend additional money for a service that is not desired and most importantly is not required is beyond me. No one shold be defending that practice.

 

Thanks


outside of an opinion - how is the requirement of a data plan fit that definition? If you believe it does, then anything that has a additional fee requirement is a "scam" in your eyes. A data plan is required by their terms of service, this does not make it a scam in the eyes of anyone but those with that opinion. It violates no tenants of the contractual law

 

If you don;t want to spend the money then switch to a device that does not have that requirement, simple as that. I am not "defedning the practice" becasue there is nothiung to defend, it is part of a legally binding contract, just like the requirement by the states to carry auto insurance to drive - or do you believe that is a "scam" also?

Message 109 of 114
Tutor

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone


wingrider01 wrote:

antiscam wrote:

wingrider01 wrote:

guess we have different diffenitions and applications of the word "scam" what you are complainging about does not fit the websters english dictionary's definition. Last time I looked being honest is not a insult, if is basicly your fault for any unexpected results if you do not take the time to review the legal terms of service.

 

If you want to match times with ATT, can do that with you although I suspect I have abouty 10-15 years on you, back to the early 80's before the court ordered break up, if you add POTS services into the mix, it will take it back to the 50's


Mirriam Webster Online Dictionary -- SCAM: a fraudulent or deceptive act or operation       Fraudulent: SYN - dishonest, false

 

Providers stating that a data plan is required is not true. It is False. By stating these falsehoods, it is a deceptive act to obtain more money from customers when it is not necessary. We can operate the phones without a data plan. The key issue here is the definition of "required". A data plan is not required. It may be desired or useful, but it is not required to operate the phone.

 

Why some have difficulty understanding that many customers do not want to spend additional money for a service that is not desired and most importantly is not required is beyond me. No one shold be defending that practice.

 

Thanks


outside of an opinion - how is the requirement of a data plan fit that definition? If you believe it does, then anything that has a additional fee requirement is a "scam" in your eyes. A data plan is required by their terms of service, this does not make it a scam in the eyes of anyone but those with that opinion. It violates no tenants of the contractual law

 

If you don;t want to spend the money then switch to a device that does not have that requirement, simple as that. I am not "defedning the practice" becasue there is nothiung to defend, it is part of a legally binding contract, just like the requirement by the states to carry auto insurance to drive - or do you believe that is a "scam" also?


There is no opinion here. There is the simple fact that the operation of these phones do not require a data plan. The providers are making it a requirement, thus a SCAM. If there is no basis in fact for an additional cost but merely a loophole to extract more money from the customer, then yes, it is a scam.

 

Do you honestly think I am the only one with this stance on this issue? There are 12 pages dedicated to this issue on this thread alone!

 

What in the world does auto insurance have to do with data plans?

 

Also, your attempt to tell me what phone to use is offensive {Please keep it courteous}. When the choices narrow down to a good smart phone or a morse code machine, what choice will people make?

Message 110 of 114
Former Moderator

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

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Message 111 of 114
Expert

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone


antiscam wrote:

wingrider01 wrote:

antiscam wrote:

wingrider01 wrote:

guess we have different diffenitions and applications of the word "scam" what you are complainging about does not fit the websters english dictionary's definition. Last time I looked being honest is not a insult, if is basicly your fault for any unexpected results if you do not take the time to review the legal terms of service.

 

If you want to match times with ATT, can do that with you although I suspect I have abouty 10-15 years on you, back to the early 80's before the court ordered break up, if you add POTS services into the mix, it will take it back to the 50's


Mirriam Webster Online Dictionary -- SCAM: a fraudulent or deceptive act or operation       Fraudulent: SYN - dishonest, false

 

Providers stating that a data plan is required is not true. It is False. By stating these falsehoods, it is a deceptive act to obtain more money from customers when it is not necessary. We can operate the phones without a data plan. The key issue here is the definition of "required". A data plan is not required. It may be desired or useful, but it is not required to operate the phone.

 

Why some have difficulty understanding that many customers do not want to spend additional money for a service that is not desired and most importantly is not required is beyond me. No one shold be defending that practice.

 

Thanks


outside of an opinion - how is the requirement of a data plan fit that definition? If you believe it does, then anything that has a additional fee requirement is a "scam" in your eyes. A data plan is required by their terms of service, this does not make it a scam in the eyes of anyone but those with that opinion. It violates no tenants of the contractual law

 

If you don;t want to spend the money then switch to a device that does not have that requirement, simple as that. I am not "defedning the practice" becasue there is nothiung to defend, it is part of a legally binding contract, just like the requirement by the states to carry auto insurance to drive - or do you believe that is a "scam" also?


There is no opinion here. There is the simple fact that the operation of these phones do not require a data plan. The providers are making it a requirement, thus a SCAM. If there is no basis in fact for an additional cost but merely a loophole to extract more money from the customer, then yes, it is a scam.

 

Do you honestly think I am the only one with this stance on this issue? There are 12 pages dedicated to this issue on this thread alone!

 

What in the world does auto insurance have to do with data plans?

 

Also, your attempt to tell me what phone to use is offensive {Please keep it courteous}. When the choices narrow down to a good smart phone or a morse code machine, what choice will people make?



bottom line - make any choice you want, but the carrier ultimately determines what features are required for a subsidized phone or a out right purchased phone to be allowed to connect to the infrastructure that they designed, built and maintained, this is business 101, not a scam at all, it violates absolutley no law that is currently on the books in any of the 50 states of the US, for it to be "scam" that is of the deciding issues.

 

As far as auto insurance comparision - it is the perfect analog - to be able to drive / license a car, financed, leased, outright purchase you are required to have insurance on it. To be able to utilzie a smartphone on the carriers networks you are required to have a data plan, does not matter if thephone is subsidized or owned outright.

 

The network infrastructure belongs to the carriers, they set the rules that are within the limitations set forth by the regulations, there is no scam outside of a opinion, unles you can cite precedent to prove it wrong.

 

Good luck, done with this.

Message 112 of 114
Tutor

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

A more accurate auto analogy would be the following.

 

Let's say you previously owned a 20 year old car that was acceptable but no marvel of technology. With that car you were allowed to drive on any road, no problem.

 

Now you bought a nice Mercedes. This Mercedes is perfectly capable of driving on any road, but suddenly you received a ticket and were told that it was now REQUIRED for you to use toll roads only. Now you pay much more than you did before.

 

But wait... you don't want to pay for toll roads all the time! This car works fine on any road.

 

Sorry!! Hey, you don't own the roads, you didn't design or build them. Too bad. You either pay for toll roads ( because they make the rules however they want) or drive the bomb. Better yet... you could always ride a bicycyle. That's what you deserve anyway if you don't wan't to pay extra! Another option for you is go and drive on another agencies roads that don't charge. Good luck finding an alternate routes.

 

Now is that the right way to operate? Is that acceptable for everyone?

 

Thanks

Message 113 of 114
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Former Moderator

Re: Data plan with unlocked phone

I would like to thank everyone for taking the time to post your comments and opinions related to this topic. This topic has been thoroughly discussed and will now be closed.

Remember to always mark items that you find useful as "Accepted Solutions”, you can even mark multipleposts in a single thread.  This will help other users find this information too!!

Message 114 of 114
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