HD Compression Here To Stay?

Explorer

HD Compression Here To Stay?

[ Edited ]

I thought I was getting unusual amounts of HD compression.  Had a technician come over who ran tests.  Everything came through with flying green colors.  He said the compression is designed so that at the optimal viewing distance of the TV, little to no compression artifacts can be easily made out which is partly true when I stand at the optimal distance for my 46" which is 10.5'.  I sit at my desk which is immediately to the right of the TV.  So I'm up close when working and glancing over at the screen.  The compression artifacts are just awful up close. 

I can understand trying to save on bandwidth but just barely squeezing by for the optimal viewing distance is unsatisfying.  I've been up close in front of my friend's TV which has Comcast hooked up and the picture quality has a "wow" factor.  I don't get that wow factor at all with my AT&T U-Verse picture quality.  I've exhausted optimazing the settings on my TV, trying different cables, ports on the router, and even replacing the box only to get the same picture quality.  Honestly, HD should be provided for free by AT&T.  That's how sub-par the quality is to the competition.

A supervisor on the chat support said that the sales department may be able to increase the bandwidth to get better picture but I think he was giving me the run around.  Sales was closed when he referred me so I'll have to wait until Monday.

After doing some research I've noticed many people have noticed the sub-par HD quality all because of the compression with discussions dating back to 2008.  It looks like AT&T is doing little to nothing to try and improve the picture quality.  Their cabling and hardware is more than capable of delivering clear, crisp HD picture but they choose to bottleneck the bandwidth in order to save money.

If AT&T increased their bandwidth 2x for each HD stream, AT&T would be the best TV service provider by a mile.  The compression artifacts are the only con holding them back from being great.  I consider AT&T U-Verse TV as tolerable.  I hate going over to my friends house now because his HD picture is so clear and crisp.  I was embarrased when he genuinely thought something was wrong with my TV when he noticed how bad the quality was.

AT&T fix this.  It's easy and you'll be king of the crop.

Message 1 of 50 (6,203 Views)
Explorer

Re: HD Compression Here To Stay?

[ Edited ]

I've had AT&T U-Verse for over 4 years now.  Just recently upgraded to HD.  We switched from Comcast due to outrageous bills and awful treatment and lack of respect.  I will NEVER go to Comcast a billion years.  I have and always loved AT&T U-Verse's features.  Like I said, the picture quality is the only thing I have a gripe with.  And I'm not the only one.

I'm going to the AT&T store and looking at their demo TV's.  If the demo TV's have crisp clear picture, I will not stop until AT&T is providing me with the equivalent crisp clear picture that is advertised in their stores.

I've been given the run around too much.  I've spent all day waiting for a technician who abruptly cancelled only to be given the run around from him.  I'm not blind and I know the techincalities behind this stuff.  I'm simply not allocated enough bandwidth for clear crisp picture.  I'm also going to get onto a 32:5 profile because my loop length allows it.  Seems like AT&T hasn't been giving me the best possible service available for my location...

Message 2 of 50 (6,060 Views)
Scholar

Re: HD Compression Here To Stay?

Couldn't agree more with the original poster.

Message 3 of 50 (6,034 Views)
Scholar

Re: HD Compression Here To Stay?

I used to have TWC. My brother has Cox and I watch at his house once in a while. I see Directv often at all the sports bars. Uverse is definetly the worst HD picture of the four. I'm not sure I would go as far as to call it embarrasing.

Message 4 of 50 (6,013 Views)
ACE - Master

Re: HD Compression Here To Stay?

[ Edited ]

Most people want the biggest TV without thinking about what it's going to look like.  The bigger the TV the farther away you need to be for it to look "good".  In my home office I have a 32 inch 720p which is about 4 feet from me and it looks great on HD.  Now if I put my 52 inch TV in place of it, it would look like crap because it's too big for the room.

 

Here is a recommended TV size to viewing distance chart:

 

Screen SizeRecommended Range
26" 3.3' – 6.5' (1.0 m – 2.0 m)
30" 3.8' – 7.6' (1.2 m – 2.3 m)
34" 4.3' – 8.5' (1.3 m – 2.6 m)
42" 5.3' – 10.5' (1.6 m – 3.2 m)
46" 5.8' – 11.5' (1.8 m – 3.5 m)
50" 6.3' – 12.5' (1.9 m – 3.8 m)
55" 6.8' – 12.8' (2.1 m – 3.9 m)
60" 7.5' – 15.0' (2.3 m – 4.6 m)
65" 8.1' – 16.3' (2.5 m – 5.0 m)

"If you find this post helpful and it solved your issue please mark it as a solution.  This will help other forum members locate it and will also let everyone know that it corrected your problem. If they have the same issue they will know how to solve theirs"

*The views and opinions expressed on this forum are purely my own. Any product claim, statistic, quote, or other representation about a product or service should be verified with the manufacturer, provider, or party.
Message 5 of 50 (6,011 Views)

Re: HD Compression Here To Stay?


Ish Kabibble wrote:

I used to have TWC. My brother has Cox and I watch at his house once in a while. I see Directv often at all the sports bars. Uverse is definetly the worst HD picture of the four. I'm not sure I would go as far as to call it embarrasing.


I've had Dish and Direct and TWC, if you are sitting right on top of the tv then they all look like crap.  As for UVerse,  the picture quality is just as good as the others and I've had no complaints. I'm on my 3rd installation and I've not had a bad picture quality issue yet.

” Auto racing, bull fighting, and mountain climbing are the only real sports … all others are games.”- Ernest Hemingway
Message 6 of 50 (5,979 Views)
Explorer

Re: HD Compression Here To Stay?

I appreciate the effort but I watch BluRay movies from my computer desk and use my TV as a 4th monitor and the quality is amazing.

On commercials with AT&T U-Verse HD when there is nothing but text on the screen and a plain back ground the text is so crisp and clear you can see the individual un-antialiased pixels.  But as soon as more detail comes on screen or there is a lot of motion the compression and bandwidth cap immediately degrade the picture quality. 

AT&T's equipment is more than capable of delivering crisp clear picture but they limit the bandwidth by a factor of 2 than what it should be.  I've done research and other providers use bitrates of up to 11-12 mbps while AT&T is limited to 5-6 mbps.

I'm almost appalled that AT&T is allowed to get away with being so poor with their HD quality.  They cut their bandwidth costs in half to increase profit when they could easily become the best TV service provider by pumping that money to it's consumers.  And if the chat support brings up loop length excuses they are full of crap.  Where I'm at I have over 20,000 kbps headroom over what I'm given in my package.  That is more than enough to squeeze a few more dozen kbps for much better HD picture.  AT&T is simply being cheap.

Like I said, I'm going to go the AT&T store near me.  If their demo TV's have better picture quality than what I'm getting I will not stop until AT&T is providing me with the equivalent crisp clear picture that is advertised in their stores. 

Don't give me ideal viewing distance run around because I'm a foot away watching my friend's Comcast and it's still crisp and clear as can be.  I shouldn't have to settle for sub-par HD because I'm "supposed" to be so far away from my TV.  All I get is bogus excuses for the poor quality.  No consumer should have to put up with this.

Message 7 of 50 (5,950 Views)
ACE - Master

Re: HD Compression Here To Stay?

[ Edited ]

I'm not technical enough to explain to you why Uverse uses what they do BUT if one of the resident experts Somejoe7777 sees your post I'm sure he will enlighten you.

 

Good luck and stay tuned!!

"If you find this post helpful and it solved your issue please mark it as a solution.  This will help other forum members locate it and will also let everyone know that it corrected your problem. If they have the same issue they will know how to solve theirs"

*The views and opinions expressed on this forum are purely my own. Any product claim, statistic, quote, or other representation about a product or service should be verified with the manufacturer, provider, or party.
Message 8 of 50 (5,925 Views)
Contributor

Re: HD Compression Here To Stay?

I agree that the visual artifacts -like blurry halos around each football player except for closeups - really take away from the HD experience. It's not acceptable at a distance - it should be like a "window" into reality - as it does with other providers and blue-ray. It's not really HD
Message 9 of 50 (5,871 Views)
Tutor

Re: HD Compression Here To Stay?

[ Edited ]

How bad is your picture quality? HD compression may or may not effect you because it all depends on your distance away from the vrad, which is a box your service comes from outside. The closer you are the less compression and higher speed profile you will be allowed. 19mg, 25mg, or 32mg being the highest with ongoing efforts to create a 4th and higher speed profile.  So the distance is a factor when hd compression comes into play, also the quality wiring performed on your initial install, the quality of your hd cable, and the resolution and quality of your hd tv.

Message 10 of 50 (5,864 Views)
Highlighted

Re: HD Compression Here To Stay?


DRN94 wrote:

I've had AT&T U-Verse for over 4 years now.  Just recently upgraded to HD.  We switched from Comcast due to outrageous bills and awful treatment and lack of respect.  I will NEVER go to Comcast a billion years.  I have and always loved AT&T U-Verse's features.  Like I said, the picture quality is the only thing I have a gripe with.  And I'm not the only one.

I'm going to the AT&T store and looking at their demo TV's.  If the demo TV's have crisp clear picture, I will not stop until AT&T is providing me with the equivalent crisp clear picture that is advertised in their stores.

I've been given the run around too much.  I've spent all day waiting for a technician who abruptly cancelled only to be given the run around from him.  I'm not blind and I know the techincalities behind this stuff.  I'm simply not allocated enough bandwidth for clear crisp picture.  I'm also going to get onto a 32:5 profile because my loop length allows it.  Seems like AT&T hasn't been giving me the best possible service available for my location...


 

 

I can't attest to your visual accuity, but as far as your knowledge of the "technicalities", your profile being higher will not change the compression rate of the IPTV, it will only give you more headroom to up your internet speed. AT&T has new tech coming down the pike that is supposed to give them a major boost in speed, but i"m sure most of that new speed will be dedicated to internet access, as that is where they are severely behind the eight ball, compared to the competition. I'm sure they'll add more streams but I doubt they'll reduce the compression.

 

 

 




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Message 11 of 50 (5,846 Views)
Expert

Re: HD Compression Here To Stay?

[ Edited ]

mdbyst wrote:

How bad is your picture quality? HD compression may or may not effect you because it all depends on your distance away from the vrad, which is a box your service comes from outside. The closer you are the less compression and higher speed profile you will be allowed. 19mg, 25mg, or 32mg being the highest with ongoing efforts to create a 4th and higher speed profile.  So the distance is a factor when hd compression comes into play, also the quality wiring performed on your initial install, the quality of your hd cable, and the resolution and quality of your hd tv.


 

100% untrue.  Distance has nothing to do with the HD quality.  All U-Verse IPTV customers receive the exact same HD streams.

 

One thing that can affect HD quality is a marginal in-home network that is causing corrupted or dropped packets on their way to the STB.

 

To test this, download UVRealtime from www.uvrealtime.com, and use the Stream Analyzer at your problematic STB.  Follow the directions in the user manual exactly, and it will tell you if an error-free IPTV stream is reaching your STB.

 

Message 12 of 50 (5,839 Views)
Tutor

Re: HD Compression Here To Stay?

[ Edited ]

SomeJoe7777 wrote:

mdbyst wrote:

How bad is your picture quality? HD compression may or may not effect you because it all depends on your distance away from the vrad, which is a box your service comes from outside. The closer you are the less compression and higher speed profile you will be allowed. 19mg, 25mg, or 32mg being the highest with ongoing efforts to create a 4th and higher speed profile.  So the distance is a factor when hd compression comes into play, also the quality wiring performed on your initial install, the quality of your hd cable, and the resolution and quality of your hd tv.

 

 


 

100% untrue.  Distance has nothing to do with the HD quality.  All U-Verse IPTV customers receive the exact same HD streams.

 

One thing that can affect HD quality is a marginal in-home network that is causing corrupted or dropped packets on their way to the STB.

 

To test this, download UVRealtime from www.uvrealtime.com, and use the Stream Analyzer at your problematic STB.  Follow the directions in the user manual exactly, and it will tell you if an error-free IPTV stream is reaching your STB.

 


The quality of your uverse service has everything to do with distance. Once the Uverse signal is transfered from fiber to twisted pair to the prem the distance is allocated for to provide you with an appropriate speed profile. The distance also will factor in how many hd streams you recieve, be it 2, 3, or 4.  There will be more packet loss over 3,000 feet than 500' given both lines are of the same quality performance. 

 

Anyways as you mentioned a marginal in-home network will most likely be the root of the problem for most experiencing hd quality issues. Get that wiring plan and call out a tech! lol

Message 13 of 50 (5,827 Views)
Expert

Re: HD Compression Here To Stay?


mdbyst wrote:

The quality of your uverse service has everything to do with distance. Once the Uverse signal is transfered from fiber to twisted pair to the prem the distance is allocated for to provide you with an appropriate speed profile. The distance also will factor in how many hd streams you recieve, be it 2, 3, or 4.  There will be more packet loss over 3,000 feet than 500' given both lines are of the same quality performance. 


 

Again, NO, the quality of the signal has absolutely nothing to do with distance.  The person at 500' ends up receiving the EXACT same IPTV stream as the person at 3000' (barring any hardware problems with the equipment or the lines).

 

This is not an analog cable delivery system where the analog signal degrades while it propagates down the cable.  This is an IP network.  IP networks, by design, deliver packets to the receiver with no packet corruption, and ideally, no loss.

 

The system works just like on an Ethernet network: the person plugged into the switch with a 15' cable has no difference in the packets he receives from the person on a 300' cable run.

 

Any actual bits that are received in error by the VDSL modem are corrected due to the forward error correction algorithm in the modem.  All components in the routers and modems are optimized and buffered as well, preventing packet loss.

 

Please stop posting your estimation/guess of how the system works.  There are many things that you're obviously not familiar with, and your posting of incorrect information is not helpful.

 

Message 14 of 50 (5,790 Views)
Explorer

Re: HD Compression Here To Stay?

[ Edited ]

I have a technician coming over in the next couple hours.  A support rep found crosstalk between my modem and the DSLAM which could cause a degradation in the picture quality.  Not entirely convinced it's what is causing the compression artifacts but the support rep thought it would help.

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