Slow Speeds - VRad is in my back yard--Help! :)

Slow Speeds - VRad is in my back yard--Help! :)

Hey guys.  I am getting really inconsistent speeds especially late at night.  Right now I am averaging under 1mbps and pages are failing to load like i'm dropping packets..  I have the full tv, phone, internet bundle and 24mbit inet.  As I am writing this my speeds seem to have come back around to about half of what it is rated which is a huge improvement.  I have noticed that all of the patch cables the installer made are pretty bad.  The sheathing is not in the connector at all if that makes sense.  A lot of exposed wire.  I am going to re-terminate all of his cables but I'm not sure if that will help or not.  I should mention I am in a new development and there are only a couple of uverse users around here so far.  Also the VRAD is literally on my back gate.  They laid/buried all new copper between my house and the vrad.  Any feedback is appreciated.

 

Here are some screens from URT:

 

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Message 1 of 17 (1,158 Views)
Professor

Re: Slow Speeds - VRad is in my back yard--Help! :)

Being too close to the VRAD is not always a good thing, check out this thread http://forums.att.com/t5/Residential-Gateway/Too-close-to-VRAD/td-p/2742231. Someone should be along to check you stats.

Message 2 of 17 (1,140 Views)
Highlighted
Contributor

Re: Slow Speeds - VRad is in my back yard--Help! :)

Where are you located?  Seems to be a problem going on in the Bay Area, especially during peak times.  We're hoping ATT addresses it soon.  See this thread:

http://forums.att.com/t5/Features-and-How-To/High-latency-during-peak-times/td-p/2745073

 

 

Message 3 of 17 (1,135 Views)

Re: Slow Speeds - VRad is in my back yard--Help! :)

[ Edited ]

Thanks.  I took a look at a couple of threads related to this and I think I may be ok as far as being too close is concerned.  They said it used to be an issue solved with an attenuater but with the newer vdsl2 it is not a problem?  Also said that my upstream Power level would be lower and highlighted in realtime.  Although it is borderline to what they said was too low, so who knows.  My issue seems to be with downstream noise and power.  Of course I have no idea what that is a symptom of.  Thanks again for the links.  They had a lot of info I had never seen.

 

Buddy, I wish I was in the Bay area!  I could deal with Uverse issues there.  Smiley Happy  I'm in ratty West, TX.

 

-Casey 

Message 4 of 17 (1,102 Views)
Employee

Re: Slow Speeds - VRad is in my back yard--Help! :)

[ Edited ]

You mentioned in your first post that the cables had exposed pair; did you fix that?

 

Poorly made cables are always a good place to start, because they almost always have bad crosstalk, causing pair-to-pair interference, which causes packet drop, and lots of re-transmissions (which appears as slow traffic). Exposed / excessively untwisted pair also permit more noise ingress from other sources (electrical noise).

 

If you can, repair or replace those cables with known-good commercial.

 

Even VDSL2 has its limits. If the VRAD is really that close, you probably still need an attenuator, IMO. Your Max Attainable Bit Rate (MABR) should be in the high 50's if you're that close.

 

If you call for a truck roll, hopefully the tech will have better cabling knowledge and skills than the installing technician. There's no excuse for a tech to fail so miserably at cable termination; they (oughta) know better.

 

 

 

Employee Contributor*
*I am an AT&T employee and the postings on this site are my own and don't necessarily represent AT&T's position, strategies or opinions.
Message 5 of 17 (1,096 Views)

Re: Slow Speeds - VRad is in my back yard--Help! :)

Hey Scott.  No, I haven't done that yet.  I need to go to the office and grab my toolkit.  I will do that this afternoon and see if it improves at all.  I was really surprised after the installer left at how bad his terminations were.  And, it's not just one of them it's all of em.  So I'm guessing he doesn't know that he's doing it incorrectly.  Otherwise though, i should say, he was one of the most professional installers I have ever come across.  I'll let you guys know if reterminating all of those cables makes any difference.  thanks again!

Message 6 of 17 (1,091 Views)
Expert

Re: Slow Speeds - VRad is in my back yard--Help! :)

[ Edited ]

Something is very wrong.  Your numbers are way inconsistent with each other.

 

For your distance to the VRAD, your max rate should be hitting the high cap at 64 Mbps, but it's at 47 Mbps, which is lower than mine, and I'm 1700' from the VRAD.  Your downstream power level is WAY too high and indicates that there's some sort of attenuation happening at certain frequencies.  The noise margin is WAY to low indicating that there's some sort of low signal area.

 

Combine that with the sinusoidal variations in the bitloading in the upstream band and I'd say there's a bad bridge tap, probably inside your house.

 

Did they do a home run from the NID to the location where the 3801HGV is installed?  I'm betting they didn't.  You need a Cat5e home run installed and that should remove any bridge tap that's within your house.

 

And yes, you're going to need an attenuator in the NID as well.  Once the bridge tap is fixed and the other numbers come to where they're supposed to be, I'll bet the upstream power level goes lower and hits the bottom limit at -30 dB.  Put the attenuator in and it'll be at about -12 dB instead.

 

Message 7 of 17 (1,078 Views)

Re: Slow Speeds - VRad is in my back yard--Help! :)

Thanks for the info Joe.  It looks like I have two cat5e cables (with bad terminations) (and rj11 connectors?)  running from the 3801HGV into my wall.  Where should those two cables end up? I guess I'm asking where is the home in homerun?Smiley Happy  My wife also has a business connection (cable) that is separate from the Uverse.  That modem is sitting in a network box in my laundry area.  Nothing to do with uverse is in that box except that is where all my phone lines(cat5e) terminate from each room.

Message 8 of 17 (1,067 Views)

Re: Slow Speeds - VRad is in my back yard--Help! :)

Ok well I did some looking and found where the home in homerun should likely be:

 

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Is that correct or no?  If this is it should I be able to follow that cat5 cable back to my modem directly?  Also, are those rj11 connecters in the modem?  If so, should I reterminate them or can I buy completed patch cables that are similar?   Thanks again for all the help you guys are providing.

Message 9 of 17 (1,059 Views)
Expert

Re: Slow Speeds - VRad is in my back yard--Help! :)

The homerun should basically be a single pair that goes directly from the NID to your 3801HGV.  At the NID the pair should come out of the VDSL splitter (I'm not positive, but that looks to be the block on the top right with the orange parts), and then be routed to the gateway (looks to be the blue Cat5e cable, using the green pair).

 

That green pair should terminate in the center two pins of an RJ11 connector and plug into the gateway.

 

I also see that there's a ground wire in the NID (yellow) that's not connected to ground, and it should be.

 

Definitely need another senior technician to come out and look at everything and clean up the installation.

 

Message 10 of 17 (1,030 Views)

Re: Slow Speeds - VRad is in my back yard--Help! :)

Will do.  Is there a good way to go about doing that?  Should I just call tech support and complain about speed then follow that flow?  Or is there a quicker less frustrating way to go about it?  

Message 11 of 17 (924 Views)
Expert

Re: Slow Speeds - VRad is in my back yard--Help! :)

Call tech support, state that your service and line have issues, and have the tech come out.

 

If they still can't fix it after that, post back, and we'll put you in contact with David in tier 2.

 

Message 12 of 17 (918 Views)

Re: Slow Speeds - VRad is in my back yard--Help! :)

Awesome, thanks.  I am on with TS now but they are having me do the normal run speedtest wireless, run speedtest wired.  Look fast speeds when wired!  Not understanding that it has been intermittent.  Not sure I will be able to talk them into sending someone out very easily but I'm giving it a go.

Message 13 of 17 (915 Views)

Re: Slow Speeds - VRad is in my back yard--Help! :)

Well, the tech is coming tomorrow between 8 & 12.  They said they might charge me if there was nothing wrong.  I said that was fine then he scheduled the tech and I asked how much they would charge if there were no issues.  He then said they wouldn't charge me.  I thought that was interesting. Smiley Happy  Anything in particular I should request of the tech?  Can I just ask directly for him to verify the home run/bridge tap, re terminate the rj11s, and put in an attenuater at the NID?  Thanks,

 

Casey 

Message 14 of 17 (905 Views)
Employee

Re: Slow Speeds - VRad is in my back yard--Help! :)

[ Edited ]

 


Pastor Of Muppets wrote:

Ok well I did some looking and found where the home in homerun should likely be:

 

Photobucket

 

Is that correct or no?  If this is it should I be able to follow that cat5 cable back to my modem directly?  Also, are those rj11 connecters in the modem?  If so, should I reterminate them or can I buy completed patch cables that are similar?   Thanks again for all the help you guys are providing.


 

The blue pair are from your drop (connecting at the other end through the "F2", VRAD, then to the Telco cloud). The blue pair are terminating at a protection/distribution block (the thing with the orange markings - if you had another phone line, the orange pair would also terminate here). The metal strip in the back ties to your ground stake. It almost looks like the terminal holding your red/green is not clamped; the other three postions appear to be in a closed positon, but the one with the r/g pair doesn't appear to be. This is a new block style for me, so I'm not sure. If that IS the case (connected but not clamped), this could the issue, or at least a big part of it.

 

The Red/Green twisted pair go to the disconnect - if you needed to cut out your home wiring for testing, this is where you'd plug in your POTs phone or RG (disconnect the grey wire and plug in the phone or RG - the jack is the "network side" of the demarc). If you have a VDSL splitter, this would be it. If you are using U-Verse voice services (i.e., no "Plain Old Telephone Service - POTS) then you may not have a splitter because there's no POTS service to break out (VDSL signal is the only thing on your pair).

 

The Blue UTP, green pair, should feed your RG on the center pins (pair 1) of the "green" rj11 jack (single rj inside a green box) of the RG.

 

Don't bother connecting the yellow wire, it won't matter either way (there is nothing grounded, only a single (ungrounded) pair. If you were using a coax "home run" the balun would sit where you see the black rubber plug

behind where the yellow wire is hanging, and the yellow wire might be grounded in common with the ground on the balun. It's circumstantial, depending on the nature of the installed environment.

 

If you are using U-verse voice services, then either or both rj11s (in the grey colored box) from the RG will plug into your nearest phone jack, and the Ethernet jacks (in the yellow box) or the coax connector will feed your DVR/STBs.

 

The VDSL portions of the copper are not really that sensitive to exposed pair or "untwistedness,"  but Ethernet is. If the RJ45 connectors (Ethernet - Yellow jacks on the RG) are showing exposed pair, that is a Very Bad Thing; if it's the green rj11 jack (DSL in) not so much (though, IMO, it's better to have the strain relief and more likely the best quality of connection). Exposed and/or untwisted pair with Ethernet is always a Bad Thing.

 

I'm a little itchy about the sharp bend in the green pair from your NID picture; that's not really a desirable thing. For example, if the tech had run the cable around the block to the right, then DOWN through the strain relief, he could have put a nice gradual bend to the green pair and not left so much exposed. That's more an issue of style, I guess, but sharp bends are usually a Bad Thing with cabling (copper or fiber). 

 

It'll be interesting to see what the tech turns up. I still vote of an attenuator, and maybe a "Noise Dongle" on the VDSL input of the RG.

 

Please remember to post back with the details.

 

Employee Contributor*
*I am an AT&T employee and the postings on this site are my own and don't necessarily represent AT&T's position, strategies or opinions.
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