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Posted Jun 4, 2014
10:51:41 AM
New Home, new AT&T customer, and need advice on internet/TV setup

Hi - My education is lacking in the networking equipment and networking knowledge realm. In addition, I'm also new to Uverse. The past 2 days I've been feverishly reading the internet on the best way to setup a router behind the 2WIRE wireless RG. However, I'm not confident I understand which solution is the best for me or how to connect it up. I've attached a PDF of my current equipment and potential layout.

 

As an overview:

Downstairs Family Room: 2WIRE RG, non-DVR STB, and a TV.

Upstairs Bedroom Closet: Th hub (where I believe the fiber is terminated) with all of the ethernet cables.

Upstairs Media Room: DVR, Tv, Xbox one

Downstairs Study: PC

 

Wireless: 2 laptops and 2 tablets.

 

Almost all of the rooms in my house I had ethernet cables installed, but I don't intend to hook them all up. Before I started reading about the AT&T equipment I purchased a Netgear GS105 Prosafe 5 port switch.

 

What I'm after is performance - both for TV and Internet. I'm not sure if I need to do the VLAN (i.e. return my GS105 and get one or two of the GS108T models) or if I can physically separate the TV and internet paths using two GS105's. I feel I'm going to need to do the VLAN. I prefer to have my TV's connected via wired ethernet, but does this mean I need a switch in each room?

 

Hhopefully I can get some feedback on the RG and switch placement. I appreciate any help.

 

 

sketch.jpg

sketch2.jpg

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Jun 5, 2014 12:16:26 PM
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ACE - Master

The GS105's are fine.

 

What you can do with the GS108Ts is to set up tagged VLANs.  That allows you to take two different ports from the RG into one GS108T, run one cable from that GS108T to another GS108T in a different room  and then be able to distribute it to different ports in the far room based on which port it came in to the first GS108T.  This is known as VLAN with tagging (the T in the GS108T stands for tagging).

 

This would be necessary if you wanted to connect a Wireless Router or Access Point for network traffic in one of your remote rooms.  Absent that, mixing IPTV and network traffic is normally relatively harmless.

 

*The views and opinions expressed on this forum are purely my own. Any product claim, statistic, quote, or other representation about a product or service should be verified with the manufacturer, provider, or party.
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New Home, new AT&T customer, and need advice on internet/TV setup

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Jun 4, 2014 9:41:21 PM
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You do not want to mix uverse receivers with other internet ready devices.
Meaning 2 ports on RG will be for tvs without a switch.
as not showing multiple ethernet connections to each room... desired.

based on layout and believing TV in family room is only for Uverse receiver...
recommend DVR in downstairs family and a wireless receiver in media room allowing placement of a switch to handle other devices. This requires 1 port of RG for DVR and 1 port for WAP. The other two ports would be used for feed to media room and study.

As the WAP aka wireless access point can control 2 wireless receivers will be able to add 1 more tv to home by adding another wireless receiver at $8 per month.

Wireless receivers have a one time charge of $49 plus 8 per month. If order the u300 or u450 package can add 1 wireless receiver without 49 fee. Please search uverse bundle... for packages and discount information.

If desire to have all items hardwired how difficult to install another ethernet cable from upstairs closet to upstairs media room?
*I am an AT&T employee and the postings on this site are my own and don’t necessarily represent AT&T’s position, strategies or opinions.

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Jun 5, 2014 7:40:17 AM
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ACE - Master
Edited by JefferMC on Jun 5, 2014 at 7:41:19 AM

You can often get away with mixing the IPTV and other networking traffic on the same ethernet legs, but there are some caveats:

  1. Don't connect a Wireless Router or Access Point on an RG leg that also has IPTV traffic (the multicast traffic will not be handled well)
  2. Be sure not to "fill the pipe" with other networking traffic, as it can cause the multicast traffic to be lost. Usually if you're using Gigabit switches, this won't be an issue.
  3. Never, ever, put your IPTV devices behind a router.

 

You will likely be fine with your diagram as shown.  Except... what did you mean by "hub"?

 

*The views and opinions expressed on this forum are purely my own. Any product claim, statistic, quote, or other representation about a product or service should be verified with the manufacturer, provider, or party.

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Jun 5, 2014 8:44:42 AM
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Thanks you two.

 

By hub I meant where the fiber comes into the hosue and all of the ethernet cables end up in the closet.

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Jun 5, 2014 9:17:27 AM
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ACE - Master

Oh, okay.

 

If you did decide to segment your IPTV from networking, you could use VLANs to do so as well.

 

*The views and opinions expressed on this forum are purely my own. Any product claim, statistic, quote, or other representation about a product or service should be verified with the manufacturer, provider, or party.

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Jun 5, 2014 9:33:22 AM
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Is there another way you would reccomend to setup my equipment?

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Jun 5, 2014 10:13:07 AM
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ACE - Master

No, that's the way I'd probably do it myself.  Unless money was no object. :smileywink:

 

*The views and opinions expressed on this forum are purely my own. Any product claim, statistic, quote, or other representation about a product or service should be verified with the manufacturer, provider, or party.

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Jun 5, 2014 10:35:37 AM
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Well...depends on how much we are talking :smileywink:

 

In the top diagram the switches I drew should the switch be the GS105's that I have or the GS180T's?

 

Thanks for all of you help.

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Jun 5, 2014 12:16:26 PM
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ACE - Master

The GS105's are fine.

 

What you can do with the GS108Ts is to set up tagged VLANs.  That allows you to take two different ports from the RG into one GS108T, run one cable from that GS108T to another GS108T in a different room  and then be able to distribute it to different ports in the far room based on which port it came in to the first GS108T.  This is known as VLAN with tagging (the T in the GS108T stands for tagging).

 

This would be necessary if you wanted to connect a Wireless Router or Access Point for network traffic in one of your remote rooms.  Absent that, mixing IPTV and network traffic is normally relatively harmless.

 

*The views and opinions expressed on this forum are purely my own. Any product claim, statistic, quote, or other representation about a product or service should be verified with the manufacturer, provider, or party.

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Jun 5, 2014 1:12:26 PM
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Thanks JefferMC, I appreciate it.

 

 

While I'm on here acquring knowledge....why it is necessary to use VLANs for adding additional wireless routers? How is this different from adding a wired router? (I'm a mechanical engineer by degree...I just like all of this sparky stuff :smileytongue:)

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Jun 5, 2014 1:39:15 PM
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In the downstairs family room I don't think you need a switch. The Ethernet cable from the RG will connect to the STB and the TV will connect to the TV via HDMI/component cables. The same for the upstairs media room. But the Xbox would plug into the switch.

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Jun 5, 2014 2:09:33 PM
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That might be true, but I'd prewire wired ethernet for netflix in which case I would need the switch I believe. Both TV's support a wifi dongle, but the one samsung dongle I had broke about a year ago.

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Jun 5, 2014 5:39:44 PM
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BeanyMan wrote:

That might be true, but I'd prewire wired ethernet for netflix in which case I would need the switch I believe. Both TV's support a wifi dongle, but the one samsung dongle I had broke about a year ago.


I think that would work. If you were accessing netflx through another device you wouldn't be getting any TV data going through the switch and overloading the switch. Similar to what I did when our STB was connected by coax. I connected an apple TV to the ethernet port on the STB and it acted like a switch.

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Jun 5, 2014 6:10:14 PM
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Sorry I meant to say there that "but I'd prefer wired ethernet for netflix...." I only have one ethernet jack in each room.

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Jun 5, 2014 7:20:20 PM
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ACE - Master

BeanyMan wrote:

Thanks JefferMC, I appreciate it.

 

 

While I'm on here acquring knowledge....why it is necessary to use VLANs for adding additional wireless routers? How is this different from adding a wired router? (I'm a mechanical engineer by degree...I just like all of this sparky stuff :smileytongue:)


The reason is that most consumer grade wireless equipment gets all flumoxed when it sees the multicast traffic: (1) They don't support IGMP v3, so they can't partipate in the conversations between the STBs, the RG and the VRAD when they set up the multicast IPTV streams, so (2) They just treat the multicast traffic as broadcast traffic.  And since there's no way to handle error retry, they slow the wireless data rate waaaaay down to make sure that it all gets received.  So it brings your whole network to a crawl anytime an STB that's on the same LAN segment from the RG gets turned on and starts watching a channel.

 

Using the VLAN to keep the wireless router on a different virtual LAN from the STB avoids this issue, because the IPTV multicast traffic won't ever go out an RG port where there is no STB requesting it.

 

If you don't understand what multicast IP traffic is, and how it's used in U-verse IPTV, I'll cover that in a later post.  Just ask.

 

 

*The views and opinions expressed on this forum are purely my own. Any product claim, statistic, quote, or other representation about a product or service should be verified with the manufacturer, provider, or party.

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Jun 5, 2014 8:18:46 PM
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Thanks, JefferMC. Yes, I would like a further explaination if you don't mind (you can send a PM if you want).

 

Also - would I gain or lose anything if I removed the switch upstairs in the closet and just used the extra ethernet ports on the RG to go to the other rooms?

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Jun 6, 2014 8:31:17 AM
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ACE - Master

Nope.  As long as you have enough ports on the RG.

 

U-verse (which is an implementation of Mediaroom, built by Microsoft but recently sold to Ericsson) primarily uses multicast distribution.  AT&T sends out from a single national VHO a multicast stream for each channel.  Each channel has a unique IP address to which that data is sent (as opposed to a normal unique host address in standard, unicast, addressing).  At the local VHO (apparently one for each TMA), the local channels, regional sports feeds, etc. are sent alongside the national VHO traffic out to the COs.  The COs then forward them out to the VRAD, and from there they can get to your home.

 

Which you first tune to a channel, the receiver immediately asks for and gets a unicast (i.e. only to its unique address) stream of channel data and that's what is used to start showing the picture.  Basically at the same time, IGMPv3 negotiation begins where the receiver tells the RG that needs to subscribe to the multicast address for that channel.  That gets relayed up the line to the VRAD or CO, which causes that multicast stream to be sent into your home.  The RG only sends the multicast traffic to the port(s) that requested. Once the receiver gets the mulitcast stream, it matches up the packet numbers its been using on the unicast stream and shifts over to the multicast stream for display.  The unicast stream ends after about 10 seconds.

 

Once you tune away from the channel, another IGMPv3 conversation gets the multicast feed turned off for that multicast address.

 

Note that mulitple receivers in your home can all read the same multicast stream at the same time.  This is exploited by the DVR such that it can buffer what is being watched on an STB, allowing for Whole Home DVR features on live TV at any STB, but also allows you to watch the same program on two STBs without requiring two of your limited streams.

 

 

*The views and opinions expressed on this forum are purely my own. Any product claim, statistic, quote, or other representation about a product or service should be verified with the manufacturer, provider, or party.

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