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Truely Unlimited Data?

Re: Truly Unlimited Data?


johninsj wrote:

You're not helping the OP, who simply asked at what point of using their unlimited plan would they possibly run into a hidden cap. The AUP is worded such that there is no such thing as truly unlimited usage, and AT&T has demonstrated that the thresholds for excessive use are relatively low.

 

If we can stay on that topic in this thread, it would be totally awesome.

 

The answer is, quite possibly, upwards of 5GB. Most definitely 10GB. For sure 20GB.

 

Translated into netflix viewing, that means roughly 15 hours of SD video, or 5 hours of HD video on the low end in a month is going to be fine. Somewhere north of double that is probably iffy. Four times that, couple months running, I would expect to get contacted for sure.


Like I stated in my post, twice, you didn't have to respond...

 

Anyway, the fact that this is so ildefined so "nebulous" is a problem...

 

Having to use words like "roughly", "somewhere north", "iffy", etc., makes it seem that AT&T can decided, arbitrarily, that just about any usage we unlimmited plan holders may produce during a period violates the AUP.

 

Surely it's more specifically defined than what you're posting here...

Message 11 of 36
ACE - Professor

Re: Truly Unlimited Data?


DimentoGraven wrote:

johninsj wrote:

You're not helping the OP, who simply asked at what point of using their unlimited plan would they possibly run into a hidden cap. The AUP is worded such that there is no such thing as truly unlimited usage, and AT&T has demonstrated that the thresholds for excessive use are relatively low.

 

If we can stay on that topic in this thread, it would be totally awesome.

 

The answer is, quite possibly, upwards of 5GB. Most definitely 10GB. For sure 20GB.

 

Translated into netflix viewing, that means roughly 15 hours of SD video, or 5 hours of HD video on the low end in a month is going to be fine. Somewhere north of double that is probably iffy. Four times that, couple months running, I would expect to get contacted for sure.


Like I stated in my post, twice, you didn't have to respond...

 

Anyway, the fact that this is so ildefined so "nebulous" is a problem...

 

Having to use words like "roughly", "somewhere north", "iffy", etc., makes it seem that AT&T can decided, arbitrarily, that just about any usage we unlimmited plan holders may produce during a period violates the AUP.

 

Surely it's more specifically defined than what you're posting here...


It may be, but I don't work for AT&T. As worded, it is completely up to  AT&T to decide what is abusive use.

 

The part I have bolded is exactly correct - as worded, any use could be deemed abuse. Have your lawyer review the agreement you signed, and they'll verify that contractually you agreed to those terms, just like everyone else does.

 

If you can stay on topic, the OP asked "Truly Unlimited Data" and the answer is "No". There is no way you can use an unlimited amount of data over 3G. If you're on a metered plan, you could pay for a lot of data, but the costs would keep you from spending an infinite amount of money, obviously. On an unlimited plan you'll run into the AUP/Terms of Service limits, whatever they are, at some point.

 

*The views and opinions expressed on this forum are purely my own. Any product claim, statistic, quote, or other representation about a product or service should be verified with the manufacturer, provider, or party.
Message 12 of 36

Re: Truly Unlimited Data?


johninsj wrote:

It may be, but I don't work for AT&T. As worded, it is completely up to  AT&T to decide what is abusive use.

 

The part I have bolded is exactly correct - as worded, any use could be deemed abuse. Have your lawyer review the agreement you signed, and they'll verify that contractually you agreed to those terms, just like everyone else does.

 

If you can stay on topic, the OP asked "Truly Unlimited Data" and the answer is "No". There is no way you can use an unlimited amount of data over 3G. If you're on a metered plan, you could pay for a lot of data, but the costs would keep you from spending an infinite amount of money, obviously. On an unlimited plan you'll run into the AUP/Terms of Service limits, whatever they are, at some point.

 


Technically, you're not really helping the OP a whole heck of a lot either.  A response of, "No" with "it's not truly unlimmited, at some nebulous undefined point in your usage, AT&T will decide you have voilated their AUP, and there's no garuntee that what's being determined as acceptable use today will still be acceptable use tomorrow"...

 

Without a defined "tipping point" how do we truly know we've crossed over into that "unacceptable use" category?

 

If I watch streamed video on my smart phone 8 hours a day every day while on an 'unlimmited' plan, how in the current definition is that not acceptable?  From what I recall of the AUP, that's acceptable use.

 


 

Message 13 of 36
ACE - Professor

Re: Truly Unlimited Data?


DimentoGraven wrote:

 

If I watch streamed video on my smart phone 8 hours a day every day while on an 'unlimmited' plan, how in the current definition is that not acceptable?  From what I recall of the AUP, that's acceptable use.
 


If you're tying up a tower for hours on end streaming video, that impacts other users on that tower. Negatively impacting other users is a violation of the AUP.

*The views and opinions expressed on this forum are purely my own. Any product claim, statistic, quote, or other representation about a product or service should be verified with the manufacturer, provider, or party.
Message 14 of 36

Re: Truly Unlimited Data?


johninsj wrote:

 

If you're tying up a tower for hours on end streaming video, that impacts other users on that tower. Negatively impacting other users is a violation of the AUP.



So, what you're saying is that when my tower gets to capacity with everyone else using tiered plans, and I can't do simple things like retrieve email, because the tower is saturated, then all those other users are also violating AUP too?

Message 15 of 36
ACE - Professor

Re: Truly Unlimited Data?


DimentoGraven wrote:

johninsj wrote:

 

If you're tying up a tower for hours on end streaming video, that impacts other users on that tower. Negatively impacting other users is a violation of the AUP.



So, what you're saying is that when my tower gets to capacity with everyone else using tiered plans, and I can't do simple things like retrieve email, because the tower is saturated, then all those other users are also violating AUP too?


I'm saying if you are a user that is causing disruptions for other users, regardless of your plan, you're in violation of the AUP. One typical way to cause disruption is to create a 30-60 minute running stream of 1-3mbps. Compared to the pure burst traffic of browsing, or email, etc, that 3G is actually designed for, long running high bandwidth streams aren't great for everyone else on that tower.

 

So, just like the simple answer to the OP (remember the OP? Remeber?) was "No" - the simple answer to your question is "Yes".

 

 

*The views and opinions expressed on this forum are purely my own. Any product claim, statistic, quote, or other representation about a product or service should be verified with the manufacturer, provider, or party.
Message 16 of 36

Re: Truly Unlimited Data?


johninsj wrote:

I'm saying if you are a user that is causing disruptions for other users, regardless of your plan, you're in violation of the AUP. One typical way to cause disruption is to create a 30-60 minute running stream of 1-3mbps. Compared to the pure burst traffic of browsing, or email, etc, that 3G is actually designed for, long running high bandwidth streams aren't great for everyone else on that tower.

 

So, just like the simple answer to the OP (remember the OP? Remeber?) was "No" - the simple answer to your question is "Yes".

 

 


What's your kick on no drifting from the OP's post?  My gosh you know these threads wind and weave and go on all sorts of tangents.  I haven't noticed you being such a stickler in other posts...  What gives?

 

Anyway, so your saying that even a person on tiered plan will get a notification from AT&T if they burn through 15gb of data?

 

Because I'm betting the ONLY people getting notifications and tossed off their data plans will be the unlimmited folks, who will use their phones pretty much exactly how everyone else will be using theirs, and since tethering and mobile hotspot features don't figure into the unlimmited plan usage profile any more, there really should be no REAL reason (other than greed) that AT&T should bother us for using our phones.

 

After all, the person on the top tier, with mobile hotspot, tethering his laptop and 4 friends definitely has the potential of pounding out more kbps than me streaming a video for the same duration of time, but apparently only I will receive notification of a violation of AUP according to how you're attempting to define AT&T's nebulous definition.

 

So with that in mind, there actually IS unlimmited data, up until the point that AT&T decides they want you to pay more and switches you over.

 

That's my party line from this point forward until a more definitive AUP is presented to me.

Message 17 of 36
ACE - Professor

Re: Truly Unlimited Data?


DimentoGraven wrote:
What's your kick on no drifting from the OP's post?  My gosh you know these threads wind and weave and go on all sorts of tangents.  I haven't noticed you being such a stickler in other posts...  What gives?


Because you have an axe to grind on the unlimited plan and you grind it anytime anyone asks anything with "unlimited plan" in it, and that derails the thread into a rehash of your arguments, which I said up front I didn't want to do.

 

So you've managed to restate again your position in THIS thread, which doesn't help the OP in the least. We know your position, you've stated it quite frequently.

 

How does that help the OP? Does it help him not get pushed off the unlimited plan?

*The views and opinions expressed on this forum are purely my own. Any product claim, statistic, quote, or other representation about a product or service should be verified with the manufacturer, provider, or party.
Message 18 of 36
Highlighted
Guru

Re: Truly Unlimited Data?

wingrider01--do you know exactly what AT&T means/meant by "acceptable use", in regards to data usage under the unlimited plan?  Is it explicitly hashed out in numbers in the ToS--i.e., if you go over 10 GB you will be flagged for violating the acceptable use part of the ToS...or is it one of those subjective definitions that only AT&T can choose to come up with at their own discretion without even having to tell the subscriber as to what exactly defines "acceptable use"?  If we're talking strictly volume of data consumed, then I'd love for you (or anyone else for that matter) try to argue strictly from a logical standpoint as to whether there is a difference in "acceptable use" in using say, 10 GB on an unlimited plan vs. using 10 GB on a tiered plan.  I mean--if I use 10 GB on an unlimted plan, it could be construed as using excessive data...but if I use 10 GB on a tiered plan, it's not excessive use of data?

 

So basically folks (perhaps like yourself) are trying to insinuate that it's okay to use tons of data...as long as you pay the appropriate dollar amount for doing so...but use the same amount on an unlimited plan and you're essentially flagged as being an excessive user.

 

Wow...

Message 19 of 36
Expert

Re: Truly Unlimited Data?


tonester wrote:

wingrider01--do you know exactly what AT&T means/meant by "acceptable use", in regards to data usage under the unlimited plan?  Is it explicitly hashed out in numbers in the ToS--i.e., if you go over 10 GB you will be flagged for violating the acceptable use part of the ToS...or is it one of those subjective definitions that only AT&T can choose to come up with at their own discretion without even having to tell the subscriber as to what exactly defines "acceptable use"?  If we're talking strictly volume of data consumed, then I'd love for you (or anyone else for that matter) try to argue strictly from a logical standpoint as to whether there is a difference in "acceptable use" in using say, 10 GB on an unlimited plan vs. using 10 GB on a tiered plan.  I mean--if I use 10 GB on an unlimted plan, it could be construed as using excessive data...but if I use 10 GB on a tiered plan, it's not excessive use of data?

 

So basically folks (perhaps like yourself) are trying to insinuate that it's okay to use tons of data...as long as you pay the appropriate dollar amount for doing so...but use the same amount on an unlimited plan and you're essentially flagged as being an excessive user.

 

Wow...


No I don't know what they consider acceptable use. More then likely it is documented in the service terms on att or you can request it from their legal - never felt the need to do it.

 

As far as your comment - about over use, if any carrier determines that the acceptable use policy is being violated then yes, the excessive use should be handled. If an unlimited user is determined to be violating the acceptable use policy the carrier has the right to determine how to handle - primarily right now other carriers are either  by soft capping the account by locking data usage to email only, allowing all protocol's but throttle the band width to 1/10 of the actual speed or actual hard capping of the account until the next billing cycle.

 

ATT took the step with people that where tethering on a plan that does not allow it by sending a cease and desist letter to the user - if they did not comply their unlimited plan was terminated and they where put on the correct plan.

 

So yes - use what you want - pay for what you use

 


 

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