Need help with your equipment?
jesserehmer's profile

Mentor

 • 

19 Messages

Tuesday, November 26th, 2013 8:55 PM

Speed issues with Netflix streaming

To start off I'm a knowledgeable Linux Systems Engineer with over 20 years experience in Internet related technologies so I've done my fair share of troubleshooting on this topic.  We also live in the city limits of St. Louis and are told that our area has completed it's Uverse network upgrades.

 

Since we switched to Uverse we have consistent issues streaming Netflix.  The initial 10-15 seconds of any video plays great, but then the picture quality severely degrades, sometimes enough that you cannot read text within the video because it is so pixelated.  I was warned before switching by other users in our area that there is a severe over subscription issue with Uverse Internet.  The more I look at this the more I am inclined to agree, but wanted to get community feedback.

 

We experience the issues the worst during peak times (4pm-midnight) but also at 4am we cannot stream movie in full HD without degradation of the picture due to throughput issues.  This alone leads me to believe my area is oversubscribed on Internet and there simply is not enough bandwidth upstream to handle the streaming appropriately.

 

We've done the following to troubleshoot:

Moved all wireless devices to wired.

Restarted router/modem (too many times to count).

Had our lines checked by a tech.

Run speed tests during - these tests are inconclusive because we have the 24Mbps package and even during trouble times we sometimes get speeds up to 18Mbps which is more than sufficient for Netflix HD streaming (you only need 5Mbps sustained).

 

Multiple devices are affected including the Apple TV that never once had an issue in its 5 years of service while using Charter cable services.  To re-iterate, never once, have we experienced what we are experiencing now with Charter cable services, but it consistently happens every day with AT&T.

 

Calls to AT&T have gone no where.  Techs say everything is fine, one even went as far as to tell me this is a common problem and he sees a lot of people cancel Internet services and go back to Charter for them.  I priced it out and we can get just Internet through Charter at 30Mbps (guaranteed steady throughput, not UP TO like AT&T) for $54.99/month without having to have cable TV through them.  That is considerably cheaper than I'm paying for 24Mbps Internet through Uverse.

 

All of that said is there anyone who can actually help me fix this problem?  I'd much prefer not to give another penny to Charter, but if this is the quality of Internet service we can expect from AT&T there is no way I am going to continue paying them for substandard service at a higher rate than the cable company.

 

Am I doomed with Uverse or is there hope?

Teacher

 • 

10 Messages

10 years ago

And, as I've said earlier, I have the super-premium... and last Saturday night, the supposedly HD movie looked like it was shot on a 1980's cell phone and it kept stopping to restream.

So if NetFlix costs AT&T more in infrastructure, pass it on to the customer. There is no way it is ethical to  charge me a premium for high-bandwidth and also selectively choke NetFlix to where it doesn't matter if I have your lowest cost bandwidth. At least choke it on a sliding scale!

Mentor

 • 

33 Messages

10 years ago

This is my opinion based on my testing and research I've done since April 2013 to Present. It is merely an opinion nothing more, nothing less.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

“While they call it ‘Open Connect,’ Netflix is actually closing off access to some of its content while seeking unprecedented preferential treatment from ISPs.”

I believe it is wrong for Netflix to withhold any content formats from my ISP and the subscribers of many other ISPs.

On 9/26/2013 Netflix made this announcement:

"All Netflix members, regardless of their Internet service provider (ISP), now have access to the highest quality HD streams available on Netflix. This means that the great TV shows and movies on Netflix will look even better on HD screens with a higher bit rate stream, Super HD, that applies less compression to the 1080p image."

Yet Netflix also said this:

"Netflix uses 'adaptive streaming' to dynamically adjust the video quality based on the available bandwidth. This means that the ability to receive Super HD depends on broadband quality and performance. Netflix members who subscribe to an ISP with a direct Netflix connection will get the best experience."

Customers whose ISPs choose not to participate with Netflix Open Connect are routinely unable to watch HD (720p, 1080p) by a large margin during prime time. "The best experience" HD Video can only be viewed the customers whose ISP participate with Open Connect. Netflix should place this disclaimer concerning their services in their advertising and service contracts. "If your ISP does not use Open Connect you may not be able to view HD content during Pime Time viewing".

Netflix services have become totally worthless and users are unable to view in HD (720p, 1080p) or even SD (480p) during Prime time (6pm - 1am, 7 days a week). Resolution during these times is worst than 480i VHS quality. As many users including myself who only watch HD (720p, 1080p), watching DVDs (480p), VHS tapes (480i) , or 480i Broadcast TV is history.

Netflix is aware of this. Netflix is diverting and/or traffic shaping all streaming data during prime time to all customers who subscribe to an ISP which does not use Netflix Open Connect to prevent the inadequate numbers of CDNs from crashing.

This has become a disaster since September 2013 when "Netflix made Super HD available to everyone" with "The best experience for those whose ISP use Open Connect" instead of increasing the numbers of regional Open Connect CDNs to everyone without ISP intervention. It is not the responsibility of an Internet Service Provider to improve the Netflix experience. It is a Netflix Content Delivery responsibility.

My Fiber Optic 12Mbps bandwidth package is 99% stable, 11.7 Mbps with 0-1% variance over a 2GB random download when testing during prime time and 24 hrs/day. All 5 of my other 1080p subscription services (Vudu, HBO GO, M Go, Amazon, Hulu) are perfect.

If the stream is not 720p or 1080p it is not HD. If the stream is 720p or higher it is technically HD. At the present time Blu Ray 1080p 24fps is the highest quality HD resolution widely available to consumers. Many devices can play only at 30fps. A human's vision has finite capabilities without retinal and lens enhancements. Depending on screen size and distance from the screen most humans without perfect color and distance vision and perfect screen color, gamma, contrast, brightness and pixel pitch will notice very minor differences if at all between 720p 30fps and 1080p 30fps.

The differences between 720p/1080p and 480p and lower are remarkable.

Netflix is blaming the ISPs. It is not the ISPs traffic shaping/throttling, bottle necks, congestion, etc. It is Netflix CDN overload.

Regardless of who is responsible, it is a Netflix problem. The top 4 ISPs in North America serve 80% of all internet users and do not and will not opt in to the Netflix Open Connect CDN "deal".

My colleagues and I want to continue to enjoy Netflix viewing in HD, 720p and/or 1080p not 260i, 360i, 480i or 480p.

Mentor

 • 

33 Messages

10 years ago

The only poor "Internet service during peak hours" in my experience has been and is with Netflix only. Never HBO GO, Amazon, Hulu Plus, Vudu, M GO, or Directv On Demand internet downloads (with instant play from the DVR recording as soon as download begins with no pauses in playing to allow the download to catch up with the playing).

Also as if magically within 5 mintutes +- of 0100 hrs CST Netflix ramps up to a bit rate of 5800 which is there Super HD. All other HD streaming services play 1080p out of the gate 24/7.

Here is the best Netlix on screen title with real on screen playing time bit rate, resolution, and screen ratio: [ Example Short 23.976 ], just type it in the Neflix search and add to your queue/list. It runs for 10 minutes. You may want to mute the sound while viewing the data.

ACE - Master

 • 

6.9K Messages

10 years ago

So, it's only AT&T that is having issues with Netflix, think again.  Comcast users are complaining just as much.

 

Here is an entire list of ISPs whose users have complained about Netflix.

Tutor

 • 

4 Messages

10 years ago

Tutor

 • 

4 Messages

10 years ago

Umm, I pay for my internet and Netflix pays for theirs. So why does AT&T need to be paid again? I never thought about going back to charter because they were a terrible company years ago. AT&T seems to want to do worse for whatever reason. And you my friend sound like a shill for them. Do you work for them, or do you just pretend to be this dumb for free?

Tutor

 • 

4 Messages

10 years ago

Why is it against the isp to request they upgrade their infrastructure? What about the $200 billion tax payers give in the 90s that was never used by the telecom industry to update infrastructure but instead pocketed.

Netflix pays a lot for a lot of bandwidth. AT&T and similar isps are simply holding the users at the last mile hostage and demanding services like Netflix pay for access to "their" (AT&T) customers. It's extortion plain and simple. This despite services like Netflix making high bandwidth services, you know, useful and worth paying for. FCC needs to get control again to bring back net neutrality. Google fiber please save us! God help me for thinking of charter again!

 

[Please keep it courteous]

ACE - Master

 • 

6.9K Messages

10 years ago


@Jsull wrote:

Why is it against the isp to request they upgrade their infrastructure? What about the $200 billion tax payers give in the 90s that was never used by the telecom industry to update infrastructure but instead pocketed.

Netflix pays a lot for a lot of bandwidth. AT&T and similar isps are simply holding the users at the last mile hostage and demanding services like Netflix pay for access to "their" (AT&T) customers. It's extortion plain and simple. This despite services like Netflix making high bandwidth services, you know, useful and worth paying for. FCC needs to get control again to bring back net neutrality. Google fiber please save us! God help me for thinking of charter again!

 

[Please keep it courteous]


No, actually they pay very little, they use a company called Cogent to carry their traffic.  Netflix wants ISPs to upgrade their equipment so that they can all use open connect which gives them direct access to an ISPs network.  This is one area where I actually think Comcast and Netflix are both going to benefit and when other ISPs sign similar deals everyone will be happy.  

And if you think Charter is any better you are sadly mistaken. You obviously haven't been keeping up with current events.  EVERY provider has had complaints about Netflix streaming. 

I've posted it before, but here you go

Contributor

 • 

2 Messages

10 years ago

Sorry to thread necro, but in case anyone is getting excited about possible throttling issues being resolved by the new Gigapower service, I can confirm they will not.

 

I've been on the Gigapower service here in Austin for several months now, and my Netflix streaming buffers or flips to SD constantly. My speedtests all confirm a 300mbps down connection, yet I'm seeing horrible Netflix performance.

 

I don't really care who wants more money from who. I care about the end result I am paying for. When I use a land line, my data travels through several providers. Providers which pay to use each other's copper and do not throttle calls from another state or business. When I get power, my power travels through the grids of many different providers. I do not care that California may use a large percentage more of the electrical bandwidth then Nebraska. I care that I pay my power provider and in turn they provide a service without discrimination for the power traffic across the network.

 

See where I'm going? This is horrible service, and I realize I'm lucky to have Gigabit options here in Austin, so I'll be exercising those options as soon as my 1 year contract is up. With all the he-said/she-said between ATT and Netflix, all I know for a fact is that Google Fiber customers in Kansas City and Grande Communications customers here in town with Gigabit service have had zero complaints with throttling.

 

It is a choice ATT made, and not one I agree with. I would love to stick with ATT if they choose a different path in the next few months, but barring that unlikely scenario, consumer choice will win the day. ATT chose poorly.

ACE - Master

 • 

6.9K Messages

10 years ago

@atxgiga 
@atxgiga wrote:

Sorry to thread necro, but in case anyone is getting excited about possible throttling issues being resolved by the new Gigapower service, I can confirm they will not.

 

I've been on the Gigapower service here in Austin for several months now, and my Netflix streaming buffers or flips to SD constantly. My speedtests all confirm a 300mbps down connection, yet I'm seeing horrible Netflix performance.

 

I don't really care who wants more money from who. I care about the end result I am paying for. When I use a land line, my data travels through several providers. Providers which pay to use each other's copper and do not throttle calls from another state or business. When I get power, my power travels through the grids of many different providers. I do not care that California may use a large percentage more of the electrical bandwidth then Nebraska. I care that I pay my power provider and in turn they provide a service without discrimination for the power traffic across the network.

 

See where I'm going? This is horrible service, and I realize I'm lucky to have Gigabit options here in Austin, so I'll be exercising those options as soon as my 1 year contract is up. With all the he-said/she-said between ATT and Netflix, all I know for a fact is that Google Fiber customers in Kansas City and Grande Communications customers here in town with Gigabit service have had zero complaints with throttling.

 

It is a choice ATT made, and not one I agree with. I would love to stick with ATT if they choose a different path in the next few months, but barring that unlikely scenario, consumer choice will win the day. ATT chose poorly.


Currently only Comcast and Verizon have signed contracts with Netflix for better streaming.  So, unless you are also served by one of those two providers it will not be any better.

Not finding what you're looking for?
New to AT&T Community?
New to the AT&T Community? Start by visiting the Community How-To.
New to the AT&T Community?
Visit the Community How-To.