Early termination fee even if account is paid through the end of the contract?

[ddlar]

Hi,

AT&T customer service has just told me that I must pay a $60/line early termination charge if I transfer my phone number to another carrier even though I have paid in full all charges until the end of my contract (in 3 weeks).

This seems truely bizarre! It seems to me that the contract requires me to pay money for two years and for AT&T to provide a service during that period.   Now, they are saying that in addition to me paying money I have an additional obligation to use their service.

Has anyone ever heard of anything like this?  Did the customer service rep. get this right?

If this is real, it must be one of the most customer unfriendly policies I've seen.  I expected them to try to convince me to stay with AT&T.  Perhaps, they would offer me a deal?  Instead, their plan is to charge me money to leave.  I guess that makes it clear why I'm leaving.

[Virtual]

Well, the $60.00 ETF is because you haven't ended your contract yet. You're about to end it, but you still have 3 weeks left as you just said. Remember that the ETF (at least the old one of $175.00) is reduced $5.00 per month of service, and it won't apply anymore as soon as your contract ends completely.

That means that if you want to avoid the ETF for all of your lines you must wait those 3 weeks until your contract ends. It's not unfriendly policy and they're not forcing you, it's just that you're still on contract, even if you only have 3 weeks left with it.

Hope this resolves your question.

[wingrider01 ACE - Geek]

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ddlar wrote:

Hi,

AT&T customer service has just told me that I must pay a $60/line early termination charge if I transfer my phone number to another carrier even though I have paid in full all charges until the end of my contract (in 3 weeks).

This seems truely bizarre! It seems to me that the contract requires me to pay money for two years and for AT&T to provide a service during that period.   Now, they are saying that in addition to me paying money I have an additional obligation to use their service.

Has anyone ever heard of anything like this?  Did the customer service rep. get this right?

If this is real, it must be one of the most customer unfriendly policies I've seen.  I expected them to try to convince me to stay with AT&T.  Perhaps, they would offer me a deal?  Instead, their plan is to charge me money to leave.  I guess that makes it clear why I'm leaving.

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Yes it is true - the etf is finished at the end of the  time comitment (24 monhs calendar), the newer smartphone etf's leave you with a larger amount if you leave before the end of your commitment.

Commitment is time based not bill based. A 325.00 smarthpone etf' goes down by 10.00 a mond if you terminate the contract at 23 months 10 days your etf is 325.00 - (10x23) 230 = 95.00, if you termenate at 24 months 1 day there is no etf.

ATT is not the only carrier that does this.

[ddlar]

Thanks for the reply. I did some research and found that this policy is probably contrary to the contract terms (below is an excerpt from the "Cancellations/Early Termination Fee" section of the contract. The Early Termination Fee is not a penalty, but rather a charge to compensate us for your failure to satisfy the Service Commitment on which your rate plan is based. This clause suggests that the only basis for the ETF is financial compensation for lost AT&T revenue during the contract term. But, in this case, there is nothing to be compensated for since I have met the full two year financial commitment of the contract. It's probably not worth my time to fight AT&T on this one. So, I'll probably just wait three weeks. In the mean time, I've already filed a complaint with the FCC. I'll file a few more complains with various organizations (e.g., the BBB) and never do business with AT&T again.

[JFizDaWiz]

but every carrier would have done just the same. that's just the way they work.

[wingrider01 ACE - Geek]

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ddlar wrote:
Thanks for the reply. I did some research and found that this policy is probably contrary to the contract terms (below is an excerpt from the "Cancellations/Early Termination Fee" section of the contract. The Early Termination Fee is not a penalty, but rather a charge to compensate us for your failure to satisfy the Service Commitment on which your rate plan is based. This clause suggests that the only basis for the ETF is financial compensation for lost AT&T revenue during the contract term. But, in this case, there is nothing to be compensated for since I have met the full two year financial commitment of the contract. It's probably not worth my time to fight AT&T on this one. So, I'll probably just wait three weeks. In the mean time, I've already filed a complaint with the FCC. I'll file a few more complains with various organizations (e.g., the BBB) and never do business with AT&T again.

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You have met the full 2 yr commitment when you are two years from the date that you obtained the original phone, not when you have paid the equivilant of 24 months service. It is calendar time not bill time, by your theory you can enter a contrqct, pay off the 24 months in 2 months and upgrade - doesn't work that way.

Hope you find greener pastures, but it will take you 2 years to find out.

[ddlar]

   Clearly you agree with AT&It's interpretation of the contract.  My reading of it is different.  It's pretty clear to me that the contract states the penalty is only to ensure that AT&T collects the full amount of money in the contract.  Since they have collected the full amount, my side of the contract is complete (regardless of AT&T policy).  That is, AT&T is now trying to impose a penalty fee that is outside of the contract. 

    Also, while I have very limited knowledge of law, I have picked up a bit over the years.  My understanding is that AT&T (or any other party) needs to show some sort of loss in order to impose a penalty.  In this case they have no loss.   So, what is the basis for the penalty?

    It works the other way around also.  I can't say that need a rebate of my monthly fees from AT&T due to the various outages they have around the country unless these outages directly affected me. 

    I'm sure there's all sorts of language in the contract to protect AT&T from these things, but there are also laws that supersede the contract language. 

    What is really protecting AT&T (and other carriers if they do the same thing) is that it's just not worth the expense of fighting this.

[drumn_bass]

"Clearly you agree with AT&It's interpretation of the contract." You did too when you signed it.

[Virtual]

Oh, here we go. Ok, let's put it simple, it doesn't matter if you don't agree with that or what kind of interpretation you have about the ETF, remember that you signed a contract with AT&T where it says that an ETF will apply if you terminate your service before the end of the contract. If you don't agree with it well, tough luck, you agreed to it when you signed the contract.

This is a common practice that every company applies, you have the responsibility to complete the 2 years of contract you signed when you aquired your service.

[ddlar]

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drumn_bass wrote:

"Clearly you agree with AT&It's interpretation of the contract." You did too when you signed it.

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Drumn_bass,

Your response is both a bit rude and factually incorrect. 

I never agreed with AT&T's current interpretation of the contract.  I signed a contract and that was agreeable to me as I interpreted it. 

It was only a year ago that the AT&T paid a large settlement over a similar issue where they interpreted the contract one way and the courts interpreted another way { Please keep it relevant and appropriate }

Clearly, two people can look at the same thing and read different meaning into it.  It's also quite possible for one party to deliberately misread it to favor their own interest.

[Per Guidelines:  Keep it Relevant and Appropriate].

[ddlar]

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Virtual wrote:

Oh, here we go. Ok, let's put it simple, it doesn't matter if you don't agree with that or what kind of interpretation you have about the ETF, remember that you signed a contract with AT&T where it says that an ETF will apply if you terminate your service before the end of the contract. If you don't agree with it well, tough luck, you agreed to it when you signed the contract.

This is a common practice that every company applies, you have the responsibility to complete the 2 years of contract you signed when you aquired your service.

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Virtual,

Contracts are all about interpetation!  You think it says "A".  I think it says "B".  In fact, in this case, it's pretty clear that it says "B".  So, my conclusion is that AT&T is just bullying its customers. 

The contract says that the termination fee is only to recoup the costs of the subsidized phone.  Since I have met all of the financial obligations of the contract it's hard to see how the contract can enforce an ETF.  One might argue that there is conflicting information in the contract and it is, therefore ambiguous.  However, any ambiguity in a contract is always interpreted against the writer of the contract by the courts.  There's also the legal issue of excessive fees.

I don't know if all of the carriers have the same rules?  They may.  On the other hand my experience with some other carriers has always been that they will bend their rules when it makes sense.   Also, just because others may do the same thing, doesn't make this legal.

[JFizDaWiz]

you must also consider the possibility of overages or a tax increase so your bill may not be paid in full just yet. or even a mobile purchase.

[ddlar]

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JFizDaWiz wrote:
you must also consider the possibility of overages or a tax increase so your bill may not be paid in full just yet. or even a mobile purchase.

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JFizDaWiz,

I think that's a good point, but I still disagree.  I'm not contractually obligated to have overages.  I could have unpaid overages at any time regardless of whether I'm under contract or not.  If I had any AT&T could certainly bill me for them.   

I'm not sure what you mean by "tax increase" as my last month's bill is paid in advance.

[savior]

ddlar

Visitor

04-28-2011 04:21:06 AM

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JFizDaWiz wrote:
you must also consider the possibility of overages or a tax increase so your bill may not be paid in full just yet. or even a mobile purchase.

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JFizDaWiz,

I think that's a good point, but I still disagree.  I'm not contractually obligated to have overages.  I could have unpaid overages at any time regardless of whether I'm under contract or not.  If I had any AT&T could certainly bill me for them.   

I'm not sure what you mean by "tax increase" as my last month's bill is paid in advance.

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under that same argument once you cancel your service the final invoice will have the month advance credited for monthly service  example 12/09/2009 - 12/09/2011  and you cancell 11/20/2011 even though your billed month in advance and you cancelled your service you would be billed etf reason is the month in advance monthly service charge will be credited.

[kdfederer ACE - Wizard]

AT&T does not prorate cancellations. If you cancel mid-month, there is no credit for the unused part of the month.

It is in their terms of service.

But also is the contract end date. If you end the contract before the contract end date, you pay, wether paid through conract or not.

[Zimtower]

I just got charged $60 for porting my number, 3 days before the contract ended. To make matters worse, im being charged for the month after the contract ended. I think another class action lawsuit would be appropriate for our cases, this is totally unfair and a contract abuse by AT&T.

[JFizDaWiz]

[Per Guidelines:  Keep it Relevant and Appropriate] it doesn't matter what at&T's reasons are for having one, it from point a to point b. you left before you reached point b

[ddlar]

Just as a final follow up.  After I filed complaints with the FCC and BBB AT&T contacted me and told me that I was, in fact, correct.  That is, I should not be charged an early termination fee after my account has been paid through the end of the contract.  They imediately released me from the contract.  They also said they were in the process of updating their procedures.

I'm glad AT&T did the right thing in the end.  I just wish the people on the phone were not so rude about it (they repeatedly insinuated that I was trying to get out of my obligations).  I also wish the AT&T staff responding in this forum were a little less insulting also.  If AT&T was not so busy insulting people while trying to protect their reputation I might have a better feeling about the whole thing. 

[wbphelps]

Thanks for posting that.  I ported my number on the very last day of my 2 year contract, and they charged me the $60 "Termination Fee".  Now I'm going to call and get it removed.  This is NOt the way to treat a customer if you ever want them to come back!

William

[wbphelps]

Wow - definitely worth the call.  A very helpful customer service person put me on hold for a couple of minutes, then came back and took the charge off my bill.  Way to go ATT!

William

[hollyjo]

I am SO GLAD you got this resolved after so much misinformation was posted about your account. 

[Zimtower]

Just got a reply back from Kevin Hicks, he said my termination fee was valid and un-refundable. What a bunch of crooks.